The Best FPGA Mining Guide and Learning Platform FPGA Guide

Transcript of discussion between an ASIC designer and several proof-of-work designers from #monero-pow channel on Freenode this morning

[08:07:01] lukminer contains precompiled cn/r math sequences for some blocks: https://lukminer.org/2019/03/09/oh-kay-v4r-here-we-come/
[08:07:11] try that with RandomX :P
[08:09:00] tevador: are you ready for some RandomX feedback? it looks like the CNv4 is slowly stabilizing, hashrate comes down...
[08:09:07] how does it even make sense to precompile it?
[08:09:14] mine 1% faster for 2 minutes?
[08:09:35] naturally we think the entire asic-resistance strategy is doomed to fail :) but that's a high-level thing, who knows. people may think it's great.
[08:09:49] about RandomX: looks like the cache size was chosen to make it GPU-hard
[08:09:56] looking forward to more docs
[08:11:38] after initial skimming, I would think it's possible to make a 10x asic for RandomX. But at least for us, we will only make an ASIC if there is not a total ASIC hostility there in the first place. That's better for the secret miners then.
[08:13:12] What I propose is this: we are working on an Ethash ASIC right now, and once we have that working, we would invite tevador or whoever wants to come to HK/Shenzhen and we walk you guys through how we would make a RandomX ASIC. You can then process this input in any way you like. Something like that.
[08:13:49] unless asics (or other accelerators) re-emerge on XMR faster than expected, it looks like there is a little bit of time before RandomX rollout
[08:14:22] 10x in what measure? $/hash or watt/hash?
[08:14:46] watt/hash
[08:15:19] so you can make 10 times more efficient double precisio FPU?
[08:16:02] like I said let's try to be productive. You are having me here, let's work together!
[08:16:15] continue with RandomX, publish more docs. that's always helpful.
[08:16:37] I'm trying to understand how it's possible at all. Why AMD/Intel are so inefficient at running FP calculations?
[08:18:05] midipoet ([email protected]/web/irccloud.com/x-vszshqqxwybvtsjm) has joined #monero-pow
[08:18:17] hardware development works the other way round. We start with 1) math then 2) optimization priority 3) hw/sw boundary 4) IP selection 5) physical implementation
[08:22:32] This still doesn't explain at which point you get 10x
[08:23:07] Weren't you the ones claiming "We can accelerate ProgPoW by a factor of 3x to 8x." ? I find it hard to believe too.
[08:30:20] sure
[08:30:26] so my idea: first we finish our current chip
[08:30:35] from simulation to silicon :)
[08:30:40] we love this stuff... we do it anyway
[08:30:59] now we have a communication channel, and we don't call each other names immediately anymore: big progress!
[08:31:06] you know, we russians have a saying "it was smooth on paper, but they forgot about ravines"
[08:31:12] So I need a bit more details
[08:31:16] ha ha. good!
[08:31:31] that's why I want to avoid to just make claims
[08:31:34] let's work
[08:31:40] RandomX comes in Sep/Oct, right?
[08:31:45] Maybe
[08:32:20] We need to audit it first
[08:32:31] ok
[08:32:59] we don't make chips to prove sw devs that their assumptions about hardware are wrong. especially not if these guys then promptly hardfork and move to the next wrong assumption :)
[08:33:10] from the outside, this only means that hw & sw are devaluing each other
[08:33:24] neither of us should do this
[08:33:47] we are making chips that can hopefully accelerate more crypto ops in the future
[08:33:52] signing, verifying, proving, etc.
[08:34:02] PoW is just a feature like others
[08:34:18] sech1: is it easy for you to come to Hong Kong? (visa-wise)
[08:34:20] or difficult?
[08:34:33] or are you there sometimes?
[08:34:41] It's kind of far away
[08:35:13] we are looking forward to more RandomX docs. that's the first step.
[08:35:31] I want to avoid that we have some meme "Linzhi says they can accelerate XYZ by factor x" .... "ha ha ha"
[08:35:37] right? we don't want that :)
[08:35:39] doc is almost finished
[08:35:40] What docs do you need? It's described pretty good
[08:35:41] so I better say nothing now
[08:35:50] we focus on our Ethash chip
[08:36:05] then based on that, we are happy to walk interested people through the design and what else it can do
[08:36:22] that's a better approach from my view than making claims that are laughed away (rightfully so, because no silicon...)
[08:36:37] ethash ASIC is basically a glorified memory controller
[08:36:39] sech1: tevador said something more is coming (he just did it again)
[08:37:03] yes, some parts of RandomX are not described well
[08:37:10] like dataset access logic
[08:37:37] RandomX looks like progpow for CPU
[08:37:54] yes
[08:38:03] it is designed to reflect CPU
[08:38:34] so any ASIC for it = CPU in essence
[08:39:04] of course there are still some things in regular CPU that can be thrown away for RandomX
[08:40:20] uncore parts are not used, but those will use very little power
[08:40:37] except for memory controller
[08:41:09] I'm just surprised sometimes, ok? let me ask: have you designed or taped out an asic before? isn't it risky to make assumptions about things that are largely unknown?
[08:41:23] I would worry
[08:41:31] that I get something wrong...
[08:41:44] but I also worry like crazy that CNv4 will blow up, where you guys seem to be relaxed
[08:42:06] I didn't want to bring up anything RandomX because CNv4 is such a nailbiter... :)
[08:42:15] how do you guys know you don't have asics in a week or two?
[08:42:38] we don't have experience with ASIC design, but RandomX is simply designed to exactly fit CPU capabilities, which is the best you can do anyways
[08:43:09] similar as ProgPoW did with GPUs
[08:43:14] some people say they want to do asic-resistance only until the vast majority of coins has been issued
[08:43:21] that's at least reasonable
[08:43:43] yeah but progpow totally will not work as advertised :)
[08:44:08] yeah, I've seen that comment about progpow a few times already
[08:44:11] which is no surprise if you know it's just a random sales story to sell a few more GPUs
[08:44:13] RandomX is not permanent, we are expecting to switch to ASIC friendly in a few years if possible
[08:44:18] yes
[08:44:21] that makes sense
[08:44:40] linzhi-sonia: how so? will it break or will it be asic-able with decent performance gains?
[08:44:41] are you happy with CNv4 so far?
[08:45:10] ah, long story. progpow is a masterpiece of deception, let's not get into it here.
[08:45:21] if you know chip marketing it makes more sense
[08:45:24] linzhi-sonia: So far? lol! a bit early to tell, don't you think?
[08:45:35] the diff is coming down
[08:45:41] first few hours looked scary
[08:45:43] I remain skeptical: I only see ASICs being reasonable if they are already as ubiquitous as smartphones
[08:45:46] yes, so far so good
[08:46:01] we kbew the diff would not come down ubtil affter block 75
[08:46:10] yes
[08:46:22] but first few hours it looks like only 5% hashrate left
[08:46:27] looked
[08:46:29] now it's better
[08:46:51] the next worry is: when will "unexplainable" hashrate come back?
[08:47:00] you hope 2-3 months? more?
[08:47:05] so give it another couple of days. will probably overshoot to the downside, and then rise a bit as miners get updated and return
[08:47:22] 3 months minimum turnaround, yes
[08:47:28] nah
[08:47:36] don't underestimate asicmakers :)
[08:47:54] you guys don't get #1 priority on chip fabs
[08:47:56] 3 months = 90 days. do you know what is happening in those 90 days exactly? I'm pretty sure you don't. same thing as before.
[08:48:13] we don't do any secret chips btw
[08:48:21] 3 months assumes they had a complete design ready to go, and added the last minute change in 1 day
[08:48:24] do you know who is behind the hashrate that is now bricked?
[08:48:27] innosilicon?
[08:48:34] hyc: no no, and no. :)
[08:48:44] hyc: have you designed or taped out a chip before?
[08:48:51] yes, many years ago
[08:49:10] then you should know that 90 days is not a fixed number
[08:49:35] sure, but like I said, other makers have greater demand
[08:49:35] especially not if you can prepare, if you just have to modify something, or you have more programmability in the chip than some people assume
[08:50:07] we are chipmakers, we would never dare to do what you guys are doing with CNv4 :) but maybe that just means you are cooler!
[08:50:07] and yes, programmability makes some aspect of turnaround easier
[08:50:10] all fine
[08:50:10] I hope it works!
[08:50:28] do you know who is behind the hashrate that is now bricked?
[08:50:29] inno?
[08:50:41] we suspect so, but have no evidence
[08:50:44] maybe we can try to find them, but we cannot spend too much time on this
[08:50:53] it's probably not so much of a secret
[08:51:01] why should it be, right?
[08:51:10] devs want this cat-and-mouse game? devs get it...
[08:51:35] there was one leak saying it's innosilicon
[08:51:36] so you think 3 months, ok
[08:51:43] inno is cool
[08:51:46] good team
[08:51:49] IP design house
[08:51:54] in Wuhan
[08:52:06] they send their people to conferences with fake biz cards :)
[08:52:19] pretending to be other companies?
[08:52:26] sure
[08:52:28] ha ha
[08:52:39] so when we see them, we look at whatever card they carry and laugh :)
[08:52:52] they are perfectly suited for secret mining games
[08:52:59] they made at most $6 million in 2 months of mining, so I wonder if it was worth it
[08:53:10] yeah. no way to know
[08:53:15] but it's good that you calculate!
[08:53:24] this is all about cost/benefit
[08:53:25] then you also understand - imagine the value of XMR goes up 5x, 10x
[08:53:34] that whole "asic resistance" thing will come down like a house of cards
[08:53:41] I would imagine they sell immediately
[08:53:53] the investor may fully understand the risk
[08:53:57] the buyer
[08:54:13] it's not healthy, but that's another discussion
[08:54:23] so mid-June
[08:54:27] let's see
[08:54:49] I would be susprised if CNv4 ASICs show up at all
[08:54:56] surprised*
[08:54:56] why?
[08:55:05] is only an economic question
[08:55:12] yeah should be interesting. FPGAs will be near their limits as well
[08:55:16] unless XMR goes up a lot
[08:55:19] no, not *only*. it's also a technology question
[08:55:44] you believe CNv4 is "asic resistant"? which feature?
[08:55:53] it's not
[08:55:59] cnv4 = Rabdomx ?
[08:56:03] no
[08:56:07] cnv4=cryptinight/r
[08:56:11] ah
[08:56:18] CNv4 is the one we have now, I think
[08:56:21] since yesterday
[08:56:30] it's plenty enough resistant for current XMR price
[08:56:45] that may be, yes!
[08:56:55] I look at daily payouts. XMR = ca. 100k USD / day
[08:57:03] it can hold until October, but it's not asic resistant
[08:57:23] well, last 24h only 22,442 USD :)
[08:57:32] I think 80 h/s per watt ASICs are possible for CNv4
[08:57:38] linzhi-sonia where do you produce your chips? TSMC?
[08:57:44] I'm cruious how you would expect to build a randomX ASIC that outperforms ARM cores for efficiency, or Intel cores for raw speed
[08:57:48] curious
[08:58:01] yes, tsmc
[08:58:21] Our team did the world's first bitcoin asic, Avalon
[08:58:25] and upcoming 2nd gen Ryzens (64-core EPYC) will be a blast at RandomX
[08:58:28] designed and manufactured
[08:58:53] still being marketed?
[08:59:03] linzhi-sonia: do you understand what xmr wants to achieve, community-wise?
[08:59:14] Avalon? as part of Canaan Creative, yes I think so.
[08:59:25] there's not much interesting oing on in SHA256
[08:59:29] Inge-: I would think so, but please speak
[08:59:32] hyc: yes
[09:00:28] linzhi-sonia: i am curious to hear your thoughts. I am fairly new to this space myself...
[09:00:51] oh
[09:00:56] we are grandpas, and grandmas
[09:01:36] yet I have no problem understanding why ASICS are currently reviled.
[09:01:48] xmr's main differentiators to, let's say btc, are anonymity and fungibility
[09:01:58] I find the client terribly slow btw
[09:02:21] and I think the asic-forking since last may is wrong, doesn't create value and doesn't help with the project objectives
[09:02:25] which "the client" ?
[09:02:52] Monero GUI client maybe
[09:03:12] MacOS, yes
[09:03:28] What exactly is slow?
[09:03:30] linzhi-sonia: I run my own node, and use the CLI and Monerujo. Have not had issues.
[09:03:49] staying in sync
[09:03:49] linzhi-sonia: decentralization is also a key principle
[09:03:56] one that Bitcoin has failed to maintain
[09:04:39] hmm
[09:05:00] looks fairly decentralized to me. decentralization is the result of 3 goals imo: resilient, trustless, permissionless
[09:05:28] don't ask a hardware maker about physical decentralization. that's too ideological. we focus on logical decentralization.
[09:06:11] physical decentralization is important. with bulk of bitnoin mining centered on Chinese hydroelectric dams
[09:06:19] have you thought about including block data in the PoW?
[09:06:41] yes, of course.
[09:07:39] is that already in an algo?
[09:08:10] hyc: about "centered on chinese hydro" - what is your source? the best paper I know is this: https://coinshares.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/Mining-Whitepaper-Final.pdf
[09:09:01] linzhi-sonia: do you mine on your ASICs before you sell them?
[09:09:13] besides testing of course
[09:09:45] that paper puts Chinese btc miners at 60% max
[09:10:05] tevador: I think everybody learned that that is not healthy long-term!
[09:10:16] because it gives the chipmaker a cost advantage over its own customers
[09:10:33] and cost advantage leads to centralization (physical and logical)
[09:10:51] you guys should know who finances progpow and why :)
[09:11:05] but let's not get into this, ha ha. want to keep the channel civilized. right OhGodAGirl ? :)
[09:11:34] tevador: so the answer is no! 100% and definitely no
[09:11:54] that "self-mining" disease was one of the problems we have now with asics, and their bad reputation (rightfully so)
[09:13:08] I plan to write a nice short 2-page paper or so on our chip design process. maybe it's interesting to some people here.
[09:13:15] basically the 5 steps I mentioned before, from math to physical
[09:13:32] linzhi-sonia: the paper you linked puts 48% of bitcoin mining in Sichuan. the total in China is much more than 60%
[09:13:38] need to run it by a few people to fix bugs, will post it here when published
[09:14:06] hyc: ok! I am just sharing the "best" document I know today. it definitely may be wrong and there may be a better one now.
[09:14:18] hyc: if you see some reports, please share
[09:14:51] hey I am really curious about this: where is a PoW algo that puts block data into the PoW?
[09:15:02] the previous paper I read is from here http://hackingdistributed.com/2018/01/15/decentralization-bitcoin-ethereum/
[09:15:38] hyc: you said that already exists? (block data in PoW)
[09:15:45] it would make verification harder
[09:15:49] linzhi-sonia: https://the-eye.eu/public/Books/campdivision.com/PDF/Computers%20General/Privacy/bitcoin/meh/hashimoto.pdf
[09:15:51] but for chips it would be interesting
[09:15:52] we discussed the possibility about a year ago https://www.reddit.com/Monero/comments/8bshrx/what_we_need_to_know_about_proof_of_work_pow/
[09:16:05] oh good links! thanks! need to read...
[09:16:06] I think that paper by dryja was original
[09:17:53] since we have a nice flow - second question I'm very curious about: has anyone thought about in-protocol rewards for other functions?
[09:18:55] we've discussed micropayments for wallets to use remote nodes
[09:18:55] you know there is a lot of work in other coins about STARK provers, zero-knowledge, etc. many of those things very compute intense, or need to be outsourced to a service (zether). For chipmakers, in-protocol rewards create an economic incentive to accelerate those things.
[09:19:50] whenever there is an in-protocol reward, you may get the power of ASICs doing something you actually want to happen
[09:19:52] it would be nice if there was some economic reward for running a fullnode, but no one has come up with much more than that afaik
[09:19:54] instead of fighting them off
[09:20:29] you need to use asics, not fight them. that's an obvious thing to say for an asicmaker...
[09:20:41] in-protocol rewards can be very powerful
[09:20:50] like I said before - unless the ASICs are so useful they're embedded in every smartphone, I dont see them being a positive for decentralization
[09:21:17] if they're a separate product, the average consumer is not going to buy them
[09:21:20] now I was talking about speedup of verifying, signing, proving, etc.
[09:21:23] they won't even know what they are
[09:22:07] if anybody wants to talk about or design in-protocol rewards, please come talk to us
[09:22:08] the average consumer also doesn't use general purpose hardware to secure blockchains either
[09:22:14] not just for PoW, in fact *NOT* for PoW
[09:22:32] it requires sw/hw co-design
[09:23:10] we are in long-term discussions/collaboration over this with Ethereum, Bitcoin Cash. just talk right now.
[09:23:16] this was recently published though suggesting more uptake though I guess https://btcmanager.com/college-students-are-the-second-biggest-miners-of-cryptocurrency/
[09:23:29] I find it pretty hard to believe their numbers
[09:24:03] well
[09:24:09] sorry, original article: https://www.pcmag.com/news/366952/college-kids-are-using-campus-electricity-to-mine-crypto
[09:24:11] just talk, no? rumors
[09:24:18] college students are already more educated than the average consumer
[09:24:29] we are not seeing many such customers anymore
[09:24:30] it's data from cisco monitoring network traffic
[09:24:33] and they're always looking for free money
[09:24:48] of course anyone with "free" electricity is inclined to do it
[09:24:57] but look at the rates, cannot make much money
[09:26:06] Ethereum is a bloated collection of bugs wrapped in a UI. I suppose they need all the help they can get
[09:26:29] Bitcoin Cash ... just another get rich quick scheme
[09:26:38] hmm :)
[09:26:51] I'll give it back to you, ok? ha ha. arrogance comes before the fall...
[09:27:17] maye we should have a little fun with CNv4 mining :)
[09:27:25] ;)
[09:27:38] come on. anyone who has watched their track record... $75M lost in ETH at DAO hack
[09:27:50] every smart contract that comes along is just waiting for another hack
[09:27:58] I just wanted to throw out the "in-protocol reward" thing, maybe someone sees the idea and wants to cowork. maybe not. maybe it's a stupid idea.
[09:29:18] linzhi-sonia: any thoughts on CN-GPU?
[09:29:55] CN-GPU has one positive aspect - it wastes chip area to implement all 18 hash algorithms
[09:30:19] you will always hear roughly the same feedback from me:
[09:30:52] "This algorithm very different, it heavy use floating point operations to hurt FPGAs and general purpose CPUs"
[09:30:56] the problem is, if it's profitable for people to buy ASIC miners and mine, it's always more profitable for the manufacturer to not sell and mine themselves
[09:31:02] "hurt"
[09:31:07] what is the point of this?
[09:31:15] it totally doesn't work
[09:31:24] you are hurting noone, just demonstrating lack of ability to think
[09:31:41] what is better: algo designed for chip, or chip designed for algo?
[09:31:43] fireice does it on daily basis, CN-GPU is a joke
[09:31:53] tevador: that's not really true, especially in a market with such large price fluctuations as cryptocurrency
[09:32:12] it's far less risky to sell miners than mine with them and pray that price doesn't crash for next six months
[09:32:14] I think it's great that crypto has a nice group of asicmakers now, hw & sw will cowork well
[09:32:36] jwinterm yes, that's why they premine them and sell after
[09:32:41] PoW is about being thermodynamically and cryptographically provable
[09:32:45] premining with them is taking on that risk
[09:32:49] not "fork when we think there are asics"
[09:32:51] business is about risk minimization
[09:32:54] that's just fear-driven
[09:33:05] Inge-: that's roughly the feedback
[09:33:24] I'm not saying it hasn't happened, but I think it's not so simple as saying "it always happens"
[09:34:00] jwinterm: it has certainly happened on BTC. and also on XMR.
[09:34:19] ironically, please think about it: these kinds of algos indeed prove the limits of the chips they were designed for. but they don't prove that you cannot implement the same algo differently! cannot!
[09:34:26] Risk minimization is not starting a business at all.
[09:34:34] proof-of-gpu-limit. proof-of-cpu-limit.
[09:34:37] imagine you have a money printing machine, would you sell it?
[09:34:39] proves nothing for an ASIC :)
[09:35:05] linzhi-sonia: thanks. I dont think anyone believes you can't make a more efficient cn-gpu asic than a gpu - but that it would not be orders of magnitude faster...
[09:35:24] ok
[09:35:44] like I say. these algos are, that's really ironic, designed to prove the limitatios of a particular chip in mind of the designer
[09:35:50] exactly the wrong way round :)
[09:36:16] like the cache size in RandomX :)
[09:36:18] beautiful
[09:36:29] someone looked at GPU designs
[09:37:31] linzhi-sonia can you elaborate? Cache size in RandomX was selected to fit CPU cache
[09:37:52] yes
[09:38:03] too large for GPU
[09:38:11] as I said, we are designing the algorithm to exactly fit CPU capabilities, I do not claim an ASIC cannot be more efficient
[09:38:16] ok!
[09:38:29] when will you do the audit?
[09:38:35] will the results be published in a document or so?
[09:38:37] I claim that single-chip ASIC is not viable, though
[09:39:06] you guys are brave, noone disputes that. 3 anti-asic hardforks now!
[09:39:18] 4th one coming
[09:39:31] 3 forks were done not only for this
[09:39:38] they had scheduled updates in the first place
[09:48:10] Monero is the #1 anti-asic fighter
[09:48:25] Monero is #1 for a lot of reasons ;)
[09:48:40] It's the coin with the most hycs.
[09:48:55] mooooo
[09:59:06] sneaky integer overflow, bug squished
[10:38:00] p0nziph0ne ([email protected]/vpn/privateinternetaccess/p0nziph0ne) has joined #monero-pow
[11:10:53] The convo here is wild
[11:12:29] it's like geo-politics at the intersection of software and hardware manufacturing for thermoeconomic value.
[11:13:05] ..and on a Sunday.
[11:15:43] midipoet: hw and sw should work together and stop silly games to devalue each other. to outsiders this is totally not attractive.
[11:16:07] I appreciate the positive energy here to try to listen, learn, understand.
[11:16:10] that's a start
[11:16:48] <-- p0nziph0ne ([email protected]/vpn/privateinternetaccess/p0nziph0ne) has quit (Quit: Leaving)
[11:16:54] we won't do silly mining against xmr "community" wishes, but not because we couldn'd do it, but because it's the wrong direction in the long run, for both sides
[11:18:57] linzhi-sonia: I agree to some extent. Though, in reality, there will always be divergence between social worlds. Not every body has the same vision of the future. Reaching societal consensus on reality tomorrow is not always easy
[11:20:25] absolutely. especially at a time when there is so much profit to be made from divisiveness.
[11:20:37] someone will want to make that profit, for sure
[11:24:32] Yes. Money distorts.
[11:24:47] Or wealth...one of the two
[11:26:35] Too much physical money will distort rays of light passing close to it indeed.
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Mining for Profitability - Horizen (formerly ZenCash) Thanks Early GPU Miners

Mining for Profitability - Horizen (formerly ZenCash) Thanks Early GPU Miners
Thank you for inviting Horizen to the GPU mining AMA!
ZEN had a great run of GPU mining that lasted well over a year, and brought lots of value to the early Zclassic miners. It is mined using Equihash protocol, and there have been ASIC miners available for the algorithm since about June of 2018. GPU mining is not really profitable for Horizen at this point in time.
We’ve got a lot of miners in the Horizen community, and many GPU miners also buy ASIC miners. Happy to talk about algorithm changes, security, and any other aspect of mining in the questions below. There are also links to the Horizen website, blog post, etc. below.
So, if I’m not here to ask you to mine, hold, and love ZEN, what can I offer? Notes on some of the lessons I’ve learned about maximizing mining profitability. An update on Horizen - there is life after moving on from GPU mining. As well as answering your questions during the next 7 days.
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Mining for Profitability - Horizen (formerly ZenCash) Thanks Early GPU Miners

Author: Rolf Versluis - co-founder of Horizen

In GPU mining, just like in many of the activities involved with Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies, there is both a cycle and a progression. The Bitcoin price cycle is fairly steady, and by creating a personal handbook of actions to take during the cycle, GPU miners can maximize their profitability.
Maximizing profitability isn't the only aspect of GPU mining that is important, of course, but it is helpful to be able to invest in new hardware, and be able to have enough time to spend on building and maintaining the GPU miners. If it was a constant process that also involved losing money, then it wouldn't be as much fun.

Technology Progression

For a given mining algorithm, there is definitely a technology progression. We can look back on the technology that was used to mine Bitcoin and see how it first started off as Central Processing Unit (CPU) mining, then it moved to Graphical Processing Unit (GPU) mining, then Field Programmable Gate Array (FPGA), and then Application Specific Integrated Circuit (ASIC).
Throughout this evolution we have witnessed a variety of unsavory business practices that unfortunately still happen on occasion, like ASIC Miner manufacturers taking pre-orders 6 months in advance, GPU manufacturers creating commercial cards for large farms that are difficult for retail customers to secure and ASIC Miner manufacturers mining on gear for months before making it available for sale.
When a new crypto-currency is created, in many cases a new mining algorithm is created also. This is important, because if an existing algorithm was used, the coin would be open to a 51% attack from day one, and may not even be able to build a valid blockchain.
Because there's such a focus on profitable software, developers for GPU mining applications are usually able to write a mining application fairly rapidly, then iterate it to the limit of current GPU technology. If it looks like a promising new cryptocurrency, FPGA stream developers and ASIC Hardware Developers start working on their designs at the same time.
The people who create the hashing algorithms run by the miners are usually not very familiar with the design capabilities of Hardware manufacturers. Building application-specific semiconductors is an industry that's almost 60 years old now, and FPGA’s have been around for almost 35 years. This is an industry that has very experienced engineers using advanced design and modeling tools.
Promising cryptocurrencies are usually ones that are deploying new technology, or going after a big market, and who have at least a team of talented software developers. In the best case, the project has a full-stack business team involving development, project management, systems administration, marketing, sales, and leadership. This is the type of project that attracts early investment from the market, which will drive the price of the coin up significantly in the first year.
For any cryptocurrency that's a worthwhile investment of time, money, and electricity for the hashing, there will be a ASIC miners developed for it. Instead of fighting this technology progression, GPU miners may be better off recognizing it as inevitable, and taking advantage of the cryptocurrency cycle to maximize GPU mining profitability instead.

Cryptocurrency Price Cycle

For quality crypto projects, in addition to the one-way technology progression of CPU -> GPU -> FPGA -> ASIC, there is an upward price progression. More importantly, there is a cryptocurrency price cycle that oscillates around an overall upgrade price progression. Plotted against time, a cycle with an upward progressions looks like a sine wave with an ever increasing average value, which is what we see so far with the Bitcoin price.

Cryptocurrency price cycle and progression for miners
This means mining promising new cryptocurrencies with GPU miners, holding them as the price rises, and being ready to sell a significant portion in the first year. Just about every cryptocurrency is going to have a sharp price rise at some point, whether through institutional investor interest or by being the target of a pump-and-dump operation. It’s especially likely in the first year, while the supply is low and there is not much trading volume or liquidity on exchanges.
Miners need to operate in the world of government money, as well as cryptocurrency. The people who run mining businesses at some point have to start selling their mining proceeds to pay the bills, and to buy new equipment as the existing equipment becomes obsolete. Working to maximize profitability means more than just mining new cryptocurrencies, it also means learning when to sell and how to manage money.

Managing Cash for Miners

The worst thing that can happen to a business is to run out of cash. When that happens, the business usually shuts down and goes into bankruptcy. Sometimes an investor comes in and picks up the pieces, but at the point the former owners become employees.
There are two sides to managing cash - one is earning it, the other is spending it, and the cryptocurrency price cycle can tell the GPU miner when it is the best time to do certain things. A market top and bottom is easy to recognize in hindsight, and harder to see when in the middle of it. Even if a miner is able to recognize the tops and bottoms, it is difficult to act when there is so much hype and positivity at the top of the cycle, and so much gloom and doom at the bottom.
A decent rule of thumb for the last few cycles appears to be that at the top and bottom of the cycle BTC is 10x as expensive compared to USD as the last cycle. Newer crypto projects tend to have bigger price swings than Bitcoin, and during the rising of the pricing cycle there is the possibility that an altcoin will have a rise to 100x its starting price.
Taking profits from selling altcoins during the rise is important, but so is maintaining a reserve. In order to catch a 100x move, it may be worth the risk to put some of the altcoin on an exchange and set a very high limit order. For the larger cryptocurrencies like Bitcoin it is important to set trailing sell stops on the way up, and to not buy back in for at least a month if a sell stop gets triggered. Being able to read price charts, see support and resistance areas for price, and knowing how to set sell orders are an important part of mining profitability.

Actions to Take During the Cycle

As the cycle starts to rise from the bottom, this is a good time to buy mining hardware - it will be inexpensive. Also to mine and buy altcoins, which are usually the first to see a price rise, and will have larger price increases than Bitcoin.
On the rise of the cycle, this is a good time to see which altcoins are doing well from a project fundamentals standpoint, and which ones look like they are undergoing accumulation from investors.
Halfway through the rise of the cycle is the time to start selling altcoins for the larger project cryptos like Bitcoin. Miners will miss some of the profit at the top of the cycle, but will not run out of cash by doing this. This is also the time to stop buying mining hardware. Don’t worry, you’ll be able to pick up that same hardware used for a fraction of the price at the next bottom.
As the price nears the top of the cycle, sell enough Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies to meet the following projected costs:
  • Mining electricity costs for the next 12 months
  • Planned investment into new miners for the next cycle
  • Additional funds needed for things like supporting a family or buying a Lambo
  • Taxes on all the capital gains from the sale of cryptocurrencies
It may be worth selling 70-90% of crypto holdings, maintaining a reserve in case there is second upward move caused by government bankruptcies. But selling a large part of the crypto is helpful to maintaining profitability and having enough cash reserves to make it through the bottom part of the next cycle.
As the cycle has peaked and starts to decline, this is a good time to start investing in mining facilities and other infrastructure, brush up on trading skills, count your winnings, and take some vacation.
At the bottom of the cycle, it is time to start buying both used and new mining equipment. The bottom can be hard to recognize.
If you can continue to mine all the way through bottom part of the cryptocurrency pricing cycle, paying with the funds sold near the top, you will have a profitable and enjoyable cryptocurrency mining business. Any cryptocurrency you are able to hold onto will benefit from the price progression in the next higher cycle phase.

An Update on Horizen - formerly ZenCash

The team at Horizen recognizes the important part that GPU miners played in the early success of Zclassic and ZenCash, and there is always a welcoming attitude to any of ZEN miners, past and present. About 1 year after ZenCash launched, ASIC miners became available for the Equihash algorithm. Looking at a chart of mining difficulty over time shows when it was time for GPU miners to move to mining other cryptocurrencies.

Horizen Historical Block Difficulty Graph
Looking at the hashrate chart, it is straightforward to see that ASIC miners were deployed starting June 2018. It appears that there was a jump in mining hashrate in October of 2017. This may have been larger GPU farms switching over to mine Horizen, FPGA’s on the network, or early version of Equihash ASIC miners that were kept private.
The team understands the importance of the cryptocurrency price cycle as it affects the funds from the Horizen treasury and the investments that can be made. 20% of each block mined is sent to the Horizen non-profit foundation for use to improve the project. Just like miners have to manage money, the team has to decide whether to spend funds when the price is high or convert it to another form in preparation for the bottom part of the cycle.
During the rise and upper part of the last price cycle Horizen was working hard to maximize the value of the project through many different ways, including spending on research and development, project management, marketing, business development with exchanges and merchants, and working to create adoption in all the countries of the world.
During the lower half of the cycle Horizen has reduced the team to the essentials, and worked to build a base of users, relationships with investors, exchanges, and merchants, and continue to develop the higher priority software projects. Lower priority software development, going to trade shows, and paying for business partnerships like exchanges and applications have all been completely stopped.
Miners are still a very important part of the Horizen ecosystem, earning 60% of the block reward. 20% goes to node operators, with 20% to the foundation. In the summer of 2018 the consensus algorithm was modified slightly to make it much more difficult for any group of miners to perform a 51% attack on Horizen. This has so far proven effective.
The team is strong, we provide monthly updates on a YouTube live stream on the first Wednesday of each month where all questions asked during the stream are addressed, and our marketing team works to develop awareness of Horizen worldwide. New wallet software was released recently, and it is the foundation application for people to use and manage their ZEN going forward.
Horizen is a Proof of Work cryptocurrency, and there is no plan to change that by the current development team. If there is a security or centralization concern, there may be change to the algorithm, but that appears unlikely at this time, as the hidden chain mining penalty looks like it is effective in stopping 51% attacks.
During 2019 and 2020 the Horizen team plans to release many new software updates:
  • Sidechains modification to main software
  • Sidechain Software Development Kit
  • Governance and Treasury application running on a sidechain
  • Node tracking and payments running on a sidechain
  • Conversion from blockchain to a Proof of Work BlockDAG using Equihash mining algorithm
After these updates are working well, the team will work to transition Horizen over to a governance model where major decisions and the allocation of treasury funds are done through a form of democratic voting. At this point all the software developed by Horizen is expected to be open source.
When the governance is transitioned, the project should be as decentralized as possible. The goal of decentralization is to enable resilience and preventing the capture of the project by regulators, government, criminal organizations, large corporations, or a small group of individuals.
Everyone involved with Horizen can be proud of what we have accomplished together so far. Miners who were there for the early mining and growth of the project played a large part in securing the network, evangelizing to new community members, and helping to create liquidity on new exchanges. Miners are still a very important part of the project and community. Together we can look forward to achieving many new goals in the future.

Here are some links to find out more about Horizen.
Horizen Website – https://horizen.global
Horizen Blog – https://blog.horizen.global
Horizen Reddit - https://www.reddit.com/Horizen/
Horizen Discord – https://discord.gg/SuaMBTb
Horizen Github – https://github.com/ZencashOfficial
Horizen Forum – https://forum.horizen.global/
Horizen Twitter – https://twitter.com/horizenglobal
Horizen Telegram – https://t.me/horizencommunity
Horizen on Bitcointalk – https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2047435.0
Horizen YouTube Channel – https://www.youtube.com/c/Horizen/
Buy or Sell Horizen
Horizen on CoinMarketCap – https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/zencash/

About the Author:

Rolf Versluis is Co-Founder and Executive Advisor of the privacy oriented cryptocurrency Horizen. He also operates multiple private cryptocurrency mining facilities with hundreds of operational systems, and has a blog and YouTube channel on crypto mining called Block Operations.
Rolf applies his engineering background as well as management and leadership experience from running a 60 person IT company in Atlanta and as a US Navy nuclear submarine officer operating out of Hawaii to help grow and improve the businesses in which he is involved.
_____________________________________________________________________________________________
Thank you again for the Ask Me Anything - please do. I'll be checking the post and answering questions actively from 28 Feb to 6 Mar 2019 - Rolf
submitted by Blockops to gpumining [link] [comments]

THE END OF ALL ASIC MINERS? - Monero's New Superweapon: "Time Locked Proof of Non-ASIC work challenge reward" algorithms.

I propose the following algorithm to end this War of attrition with ASIC / FPGA manufacturers , hopefully once and for all and save us Precious PoW Tweaks during the upcoming forks.
"A time-locked, Proof of 'Non-ASIC work' Challenge reward algorithm"
Here's an image to help you visualise how the algorithm works (details below):
https://imgur.com/a/9S8dA
Here's why we need it:
ASIC manufacturers mine in Secret to attack our decentralized network. They'll win the war since they'll 'get their investment back' before we brick their ASICs, allowing them to launch never-ending attacks against our decentralization, for eternity.
Quick Overview
This algorithm uses the concept of "time-locked reward challenges".
The algorithm ‘time-locks’ the reward, then issues a ‘non-ASIC’ work challenge during each regular PoW Fork, which distributes mined rewards only to CPU and GPU miners who can pass the challenge and prove they are not ASICS, by maintaining their hashrate during the ASIC downtime.
These Hash-rate challenges after PoW Forks successfully ‘detect’, and ‘Severely Penalize’ anyone Mining with an ASIC/FPGA, even those in Secret.
Proof of Concept: An Actual Demonstration
I'll demonstrate this algorithm in action:
Please see this image to help you Visualise how the algorithm works:
https://imgur.com/a/9S8dA
There is a critical flaw and uniquely identifying feature that exists in absolutely 'ALL ASIC and FPGA miners', even those mining in Secret.
As most of you may know, with the upcoming V7 PoW hardfork,
Instead of just destroying an ASIC with a fork, we can further exploit this to attack the ASIC Manufacturer or Miner by taking back all their mined rewards and giving them to the community
The Special timeframe is PoW Fork + 'N' Days. ('N' being however many days remaining where it would be "impossible" to build and startup a new ASIC/FPGA after the fork.)
To exploit this, the algorithm introduces a period of time called the "Mining Rewards Collection Timeframe" (MRCT), the time period in between regular PoW Hardforks. the grey shaded area in this image
This "Mining Rewards Collection Timeframe" is a time whereby all mining profit rewards are 'time-locked' or held hostage in escrow, on either the mining pool, or on the Actual Blockchain code itself, or Both, depending on where this algorithm is eventually deployed.
The algorithm stores the wallet address a mining reward belongs to, and the maximum hash rate (or maximum value adjusted share rate per day) observed during the "Mining rewards collection timeframe" for that particular wallet address.
This "Mining Rewards Collection Timeframe" can be of any duration as required by the developers; 1,2,3,4,5,6 Months or longer . The longer This Timeframe, the more dangerous it is to ASIC miners. Meaning we don't have to rush with forks.
Since it's time-locked, mined coins/rewards cannot be cashed out until the coming challenge; However, mining pools can still choose to payout smaller miners before that time if they have a 'good stable Non-Asic Hash challenge passing history', or a deposit on file, or at their own risk, so most good miners don't have to wait to cashout rewards!. Big miners on the other hand, won't care! Why? Because the delay doesn't cost them anything. (it's a TINY TINY inconvenience compared to the damage ASICs would do to GPU mining profits. I hope this makes sense)
Now for the Critical ANTI-ASIC Work Challenge.
Time passes and the mining rewards collection timeframe ends with a Hardfork that changes the PoW algorithm slightly,
All ASICS and FPGAs are INSTANTLY destroyed.
At the same time, the mining rewards from that collection timeframe are now ready to be paid out.
Since only the CPU / GPU miners are able to hash normally,
The Algorithm now issues a Hash Rate challenge to determine how much of the coins mined were actually mined by ASIC or FPGA miners.
The challenge is nothing special. Miners just have to leave their miners running normally at maximum speed for the period of the challenge, same as they do everyday!
During this challenge, their "Average Maximum Hash rate during the challenge" is compared to the "Maximum Hash Rate speed" recorded on the blockchain during the Mining Rewards Collection Timeframe.
See the green dotted line in the image
Thus at this point, since ASICs are DEAD, they cannot Hash at the same rate during this challenge period, so any significant difference in hashrate would thus clearly indicate the use of an ASIC or FPGA miner.
Now, we have all the information we need to STRIP ASIC Miners of ALL their gains, and Reward GPU miners instead.
As shown in the earlier image
What if a 1 GPU breaks in a 12 GPU mining farm during the challenge? (Very rare) or for some reason, you can't mine during that period? then the miner can simply rent the GPUs from nicehash for the Challenge. An ASIC miner however, cannot use this strategy (because ASICS are not GPUs, explained further below). Also we can implement a 2nd chance option; the confiscated reward may be frozen for the next Cycle; and the miner may get a 2nd chance to prove the hashrate again, with a % reward penalty.
The Beautiful thing is that If ASIC miners fail the challenge, Everyone gets a Bonus share of the Reward Forefitted by the ASIC miners, So Everyone wants the ASIC miners to fail so they get Free extra money. and thus have a financial reason to support this algorithm.
*There is no escaping it... or is there?
Is it ASIC PROOF? Can you Cheat this algorithm?
I've also tried to see if you can work around this algorithm:
  • Example 1: What if they switched in GPUS to mine for an ASIC during the challenge? Well, that wouldn't work. When the challenge comes, they can either save the rewards mined by the GPUs, or save the rewards mined by the ASICs, One will always be lost and result is the same anyway because you'd only get paid for the Hash rate of the GPU. The ASIC portion of the hash rate will ALWAYS be lost.
  • Example 2: What if they use the GPUs to mine a different coin and have them only hash for the ASIC during the challenge period?
  • Consider the Antminer X3. at 200KH/s, to support just "ONE ASIC", they would need over 200 RX 580 Cards or 100 VEGA cards to pass the challenge... costing well over $60,000 (SIXTY THOUSAND DOLLARS) and if they depreciate at ~ 10~15% a year, they'd lose $6000~$9000 a year. it's not enough to cover your losses,
  • Also, What other coin could you mine? If ASICS are so powerful, there won't be another coin except those running this algorithm. Then, the dev can choose to issue the challenge at the same point as the other coin using the same algorithm, so they lose all rewards from one coin as 1 rig cannot sustain two challenge algorithms at the same time.
  • Example 3: What if they just leave some GPUS on standby to avoid the power costs? Then ASIC's would still be unable to be mass produced anyway. Because for every ASIC Mass produced, you'd need to Mass Produce 200 times the GPUS to support them in their place, and own of all them. practically impossible.
  • Example 4: What if they rented hashing power from Nicehash to fill in during the Challenge period?
  • Yes, but so can we! The beautiful thing about this algorithm, is if we rent the limited hashing power on Nicehash first before them at break even or loss, it doesn't matter, Because, the ASIC miner cannot rent and hash rate and will fail the challenge, and Forefit the ENORMOUS amount of Rewards to the community. Imagine, Mining at such a high rate for months on end , the rewards confiscated and paid to GPU miners will easily offset any of the tiny losses renting hashrate from Nicehash, so ultimately, The ASIC miners lose Everything, and the community (you and me) gets all their money.
  • Also if ASICs Dominate the crypto market, there won't be any GPU to rent, all remaining coins would be mining this algorithm, meaning they would have to save their own hashrate for themselves, not rent it to ASIC miners. otherwise they lose their reward. Brand new users may rent their GPU's but its no where near enough to cover the ASIC hash shortfall in the challenge.
  • Example 5: What if they waited till we exhausted our supply of PoW fork tweaks? That's the beauty of this algorithm!. We don't actually have to tweak the PoW algorithm on a constant basis! We can intentionally leave it the same. So Everyone passes the Challenge, Then when we do detect an asic "trying to Mine their Money Back in secret (as they do now)", We tweak the PoW at the Next Hardfork. Destroying and bankrupting their very first attempt, and we get all their money and rewards, So there's no need to waste a PoW tweak in a pre-emptive strike, because the rewards are Time-Locked to the future. We can lie in wait with a single PoW like a Trap, and eat them alive (literally we get all their rewards after the challenge!). We can maintain this lethal threat to ASIC manufacturers without having to change the PoW at all!
And remember, all this effort is just for ONLY, ONE ASIC. meaning you Can't mass produce it.
So ultimately it wouldn't even make sense to even develop an ASIC, as you'd be far more profitable just mining only with the 200+ GPU's required to cheat the algorithm.
*So in summary, *
  • No ASIC/FPGA miner can escape the challenge. Not even those running in secret.
  • All ASIC miners are guaranteed to suffer a huge (possibly fatal) financial loss, with no prospect of any return on investment. Time locked rewards ensure No secret pre-mining with ASICs is possible. ASICs are destroyed with each challenge, all R&D and manufacturing costs and the electricity bill used to power them is wasted for basically "ZERO returns",
  • …..and lets not forget that all their rewards gets given away to other honest miners like you and Me!. ( LOL!) or potentially the developers of the fork :)
  • As long as the algorithm is active and used by multiple coins, no ASICs will ever exist to mine in secret,
  • We save precious PoW tweak changes, since there's no need for a pre-emptive PoW strike to prevent 'ASIC hit and run' pre-mine scenarios.
  • ASIC manufacturers see that the war is un-winnable and go invest in other things,
So, in theory, The War Ends. (at least for a very good part of the future)
As they say: " Don't build a wall and hide in fear.... Build a wall and launch missiles from behind it against the enemy so they will never dare attack us again."
I would like to point out that time locked reward challenges are already in use by the Olympic games to Strip drug cheats in the past by storing samples and testing them in the future, and it's also in the PPLNS minig pool algorithms to deter pool hopping cheats, and also in the Bitcoin's Lightning network in the form of decrementing time-locks" that 'enforce the transfer of funds' under certain conditions.
Is it beautiful? Will it work? Can it be done? Let's discuss this
submitted by MoneroChan to Monero [link] [comments]

Vertcoin Mining AMA

What is Vertcoin?

Vertcoin was created in 2014. It is a direct hedge against long term mining consensus centralization on the Bitcoin mining network. Vertcoin achieves its mining consensus solely through Graphics Cards as they are the most abundant / widely available consensus devices that produce a reasonable amount of hashrate. This is done using a mining algorithm that deliberately geared against devices like ASICs, FPGAs and CPUs (due to botnets) making them extremely inefficient. Consensus distribution over time is the most important aspect of a blockchain and should not be taken lightly. It is critical that you understand what blockchain specifications mean/do to fully understand Vertcoin.

Mining Vertcoin

When users of our network send each other Vertcoin, their transactions are secured by a process called mining. Miners will compose a so-called block out of the pending transactions, and need to perform a large number of computations called hashes in order to produce the Proof-of-Work. With this Proof-of-Work, the block is accepted by the network and the transactions in it become confirmed.
Mining is essentially a race. Whoever finds a valid Proof-of-Work and gets the block propagated over more than half of the Vertcoin network first, wins this race and is allowed to reward themselves with the block reward. The block reward is how new Vertcoin come in circulation. This block reward started at 50 VTC when Vertcoin was launched, and halves every four years. The current block reward is 25 VTC.
Vertcoin's One Click Miner: https://github.com/vertcoin-project/One-Click-Minereleases
Learn more about mining here: https://vertcoin.org/mine/
Specification List:
· Launch date: Jan 11, 2014
· Proof-Of-Work (Consensus Mechanism)
· Total Supply: 84,000,000 Vertcoin
· Preferred Consensus Device: GPU
· Mining Algorithm: Lyra2REv3 (Made by Vertcoin)
· Blocktime: 2.5 minutes
· SegWit: Activated
· Difficulty Adjustment Algorithm: Kimoto Gravity Well (Every Block)
· Block Halving: 4 year interval
· Initial Block Reward: 50 coins
· Current Block Reward: 25 coin
More spec information can be found here: https://vertcoin.org/specs-explained/

Why Does Vertcoin Use GPUs Then?

ASIC’s (Manufactuer Monopoly)
If mining were just a spade sure, use the most powerful equipment which would be an ASIC. The problem is ASICs are not widely available, and just happen to be controlled by a monopoly in China.
So, you want the most widely available tool that produces a fair amount of hashrate, which currently manifests itself as a Graphics Card.
CPUs would be great too but unfortunately there are viruses that take over hundreds of thousands of computers called Botnets (they’re almost as bad as ASICs).

Mining In Pools

Because mining is a race, it’s difficult for an individual miner to acquire enough computational power to win this race solo. Therefore there’s a concept called pool-mining. With pool-mining, miners cooperate in finding the correct Proof-of-Work for the block, and share the block reward based on the work contributed. The amount of work contributed is measured in so-called shares. Finding the Proof-of-Work for a share is much easier than finding it for a block, and when the cooperating miners find the Proof-of-Work for the block, they distribute the reward based on the number of shares each miner found. Vertcoin always recommends using P2Pool to keep mining as decentralized as possible.
How Do I Get Started?
If you want to get started mining, check out the Mine Vertcoin page.

Vertcoin just forked to Lyra2REv3 and we are currently working on Verthash

Verthash is and was under development before we decided to hard fork to Lyra2REv3. While Verthash would’ve resulted in the same effect for ASICs (making them useless for mining Vertcoin), the timeline was incompatible with the desire to get rid of ASICs quickly. Verthash is still under development and tries to address the outsourcability problem.
Verthash is an I/O bound algorithm that uses the blockchain data as input to the hashing algorithm. It therefore requires miners to have all the blockchain data available to them, which is currently about 4 GB of data. By making this mining data mandatory, it will become harder for auto profit switching miners — like the ones that rent out their GPU to Nicehash — because they will need to keep a full node running while mining other algorithms for the moment Verthash becomes more profitable — the data needs to be available immediately since updating it can take a while.
Over the past month, we have successfully developed a first implementation of Verthash in the Vertcoin Core code base. Within the development team we have run a few nodes on Testnet to test the functionality — and everything seems to work properly. The next step is to build out the GPU miners for AMD and Nvidia. This is a NOETA at the moment, since we’re waiting on GPU developers which are in high demand. Once the miners are ready, we’ll be releasing the Vertcoin 0.15 beta that hardforks the testnet together with the miners for the community to have a testrun. Given the structural difference between Lyra2RE and Verthash, we’ll have to run the testnet for a longer period than we did with the Lyra2REv3 hard fork. We’ll have to make sure the system is reliable before hardforking our mainnet. So the timeline will be longer than with the Lyra2REv3 hard fork.
Some people in the community have voiced concerns about the fact that Verthash development is not being done “out in the open”, i.e.: the code commits are not visible on Github. The main two reasons for us to keep our cards to our chest at this stage are: (1) only when the entire system including miners has been coded up can we be sure the system works, we don’t want to release preliminary stuff that doesn’t work or isn’t secure. Also (2) we don’t want to give hardware manufacturers or mining outsourcing platforms a head start on trying to defeat the mechanisms we’ve put in place.

Links and Resources

· Twitter: https://twitter.com/Vertcoin
· Donations: vertcoin.org/donate
· Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/vertcoin
· Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/vertcoin/
· Official Website: https://vertcoin.org/
· Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/vertcoin
· Vertcoin Talk: https://soundcloud.com/vertcoin-talk
· Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/vertcoin
submitted by Canen01 to gpumining [link] [comments]

Andreas Antonopoulos gets "Satoshi's Vision" completely wrong and shows his misunderstanding of the system. He thinks 1 cpu 1 vote means 1 user 1 vote, a common mistake from people on the Core side.

In this video at the 6m20s mark Andreas Antonopoulos speaks about Satoshi's vision. He speaks about "1 cpu 1 vote" saying that Satoshi designed the system to be decentralized as possible, but Andreas completely misunderstands the meaning of 1 cpu 1 vote. He is falling into the common trap of conflating 1cpu 1 vote with 1 user 1 vote.
Andreas, haven't you even read nChains paper about POW and Theory of the Firm? A cpu is an economic resource:
One of the little-known aspects of bitcoin is the nature of the proof of work system. There are many people, especially those who support a UASF or PoW change that believe a distributed system should be completed as a mesh. In this, they confuse centralised systems with centrality. The truth of the matter, no matter which proof of work system is implemented, they all follow a maximal growth curve that reflects the nature of the firm as detailed in 1937 by Ronald Coase (1937).
The bitcoin White Paper was very specific. users of the system "vote with their CPU power" [1]. What this means, is that the system was never generated to give one vote per person. It is designed purely around economic incentives individuals with more hash power will have provided more investment into the system. These individuals who invest more in the system gain more say in the system. At the same time, no one or even two individuals can gain complete control of the system. We'll explore the nature of cartels in a separately, but these always fail without government intervention. The reason for cartels failing comes down to the simple incentivisation of the most efficient member. The strongest cartel member always ends up propping up the weakest. This leads to a strategy of defection.
No proof of work-based solution ever allows for a scenario where you have one vote to one person. The anti-sybiling functions of bitcoin and all other related systems based on proof of work or similar derivatives are derived from an investment based strategy. Solutions to the implementation of ASIC based systems are constantly proposed as a methodology of limiting the centralisation of proof of work systems as it is termed. The truth of the matter is that the mining function within any proof of work system naturally aligns to business interests. This leads to corporations running machines within data centres. On the way that democracies and republics have migrated away from small groups of people individually voting for an outcome towards a vote for a party, the transactional costs associated with individual choice naturally leads to corporate solutions. In this, the corporation mirrors a political party.
In this paper, we address the issues of using alternate approval work systems with regards to either incorporating alternate functions in an extension of simply securing the network against the use of proof of work systems to create a one person one vote scenario in place of economic incentivisation. We will demonstrate conclusively that all systems migrate to a state of economic efficiency. The consequence of this is that systems form into groups designed to maximise returns. The effect is that bitcoin is not only incentive compatible but is optimal. No system can efficiently collapse into an order of one vote one individual and remain secure. In the firm-based nature of bitcoin, we demonstrate that the inherent nature of the firm is reflected within mining pools. Multiple aggregation strategies exist. The strategies range from the creation of collective firms where members can easily join or leave (mining pools) through to more standard corporate structures
Proof of Work as it relates to the theory of the firm. that are successful within any proof of work system. The system was determined to be based on one- vote per CPU (Satoshi, 2008) and not one vote per person or one vote per IP address. The reasons for this is simple, there is no methodology available that can solve byzantine consensus on an individual basis. The solution developed within bitcoin solves this economically using investment. The parties signal their intent to remain bound to the protocol through a significant investment. Those parties that follow the protocol are rewarded. The alternative strategy takes us back to the former and failed systems such as e-cash that could not adequately solve Sybil attacks and decentralise the network. Bitcoin manages to maintain the decentralise nature of the network through a requirement that no individual party can ever achieve more than 50% of the network hash rate.
In all proof of work systems, there are requirements to inject a costly signal into the network that is designed as the security control. To many people, they believe that the cryptographic element, namely the hashing process is the security feature of bitcoin. This is a fallacy, it is the economic cost that is relevant to the overall system and not the individual element.
The benefits of a hash function are that they are difficult to solve in the nature of the proof of work algorithm but are easy to verify. This economic asymmetry is one of the key features of bitcoin. Once a user has found a solution, they know it can be quickly broadcast and verified by others. Additionally, the hash algorithm provides a fair distribution system based on the amount of invested hash rate. The distinction from proof of stake solution as has been proposed comes in the requirement to constantly reinvest. A proof of stake system requires a single investment. Once this investment is created, the system is incentivised towards the protection of the earlier investment. This leads to a scenario known as a strategic oligopoly game.
The solution using a proof of work algorithm is the introduction of an ongoing investment. This is different to an oligopoly game in that sunk cost cannot make up for continued investment. In a proof of stake system, prior investment is crystallised allowing continued control with little further investment. Proof of work differs in that it requires continuous investment. More than this, it requires innovation. As with all capitalist systems, they are subject to Schumpeterian dynamical change (Shumpeter, 1994). The system of creative destruction allows for cycles of innovation. Each innovation leads to waves of creation over the destruction of the old order.
This process creates continued growth. Proof of work-based systems continue to grow and continue to update and change. Any incumbent corporation or other entity needs to continue to invest knowing that their continued dominance is not assured. In bitcoin, we have seen innovative leaps as people moved from CPU-based mining into GPU-based systems. This initial innovation altered the software structure associated with the mining process in bitcoin. That change significantly altered the playing field leading to novel techniques associated with FPGAs and later ASICs dedicated to a specific part of the mining process.
The error held by many people is that this move from a CPU-based solution into more costly implementations could have been averted. A consequence of this has been the introduction of alternative proof of work systems into many of the alt-coins
These systems have been implemented without the understanding that it is not the use of ASICs that is an issue. It is that the belief that individual users can individually mine in a mesh system will be able to be implemented as a successful proof of work. In the unlikely event that a specialised algorithm was implemented that could only run once on any one machine CPU, it would still lead to the eventual creation of corporate data centres for mining. In the section above, we showed using Arrow’s theorem how only a single use proof of work system can be effective. If we extend this and look at the Theory of the Firm (Coase, 1937) we note that in a system in Litecoin and Dogecoin for example. A00137:
Proof of Work as it relates to the theory of the firm. of prices, reduction could be carried out without any organisation. One issue against this arises from the cost of information. Interestingly, as we move into a world of increasingly more information, it becomes scarce information that is important. As the amount of information becomes more voluminous, the ability to uncover accurate and timely information becomes scarcer. The ability to specialise in the coordination of the various factors of production and the distribution of information leads towards vertical integration within firms. We see this first voiced in Adam Smith’s (Smith, 1776) postulation on the firm:
Everyone can choose to either seek further information or act on the information that they already have. This information can be in the form of market knowledge, product knowledge, or expertise, but at some point, the individual needs to decide to act. There is a cost to obtaining information. The returns on obtaining more information hit a maximum level and start to decrease at a certain point. The entrepreneur acts as a guiding influence managing the risk associated with incomplete information compared to the risk of not acting but rather waiting to obtain more information.
In the instance of bitcoin mining, the firm can increase in size through the integration of multiple specialist roles. Even given the assumption that any one process can run on but a single CPU, we come to the scenario of high-end datacentre servers. The Intel Xeon Phi 7290f implements 72 Atom CPU Cores. Each core runs two threads. Even taking the control system into account, this leaves 142 processes able to run per system. With four cards per RU this allows for datacentre implementations of 5,964 mining processes to run on a pure CPU-based proof of work implementation. One person can manage a small number of mining server implementations within a home or small business environment. In large data centre-based organisations such as Facebook, a single administrator can run 20,000 servers
The effect of this would be one individual managing 2,840,000 individual CPU-based mining processes. This alone is outside the scaling capabilities of any individual. This can be further enhanced as cost savings through the creation of large data centres, management savings and integrating multiple network and systems administrators is considered. As we start to add additional layers we come to a maximum where it is no longer profitable to grow the firm in size. Right up until that point, the firm will grow.
submitted by cryptorebel to btc [link] [comments]

Debunking myths about mining and GPUs

E: Going to bed, will contribute more tomorrow. Thanks for the discussion!
Myth: Mining is more stressful than gaming. Fact: It depends. During the old days, this was plausible, because older GPUs (Pre-polaris) are/were bottlenecked by core clock when mining the most profitable coins. Thus, miners overclocked and overvolted these cards quite frequently, especially with cheap electricity. This meant that those cards were often run hot, pushing the limits and stressing VRM and fans quite a lot. Nowadays, ethash (Ethereum) is the most profitable algorithm for AMD cards 99% of the time, and newer GPUs (Polaris) are limited by memory bandwidth and latency. Miners can underclock core to the low 1100MHz range before seeing performance drop. To save power, miners who know what they are doing also undervolt, since it is no longer necessary to sustain a high core clock. Thus, it is quite feasible to run polaris cards below 70C at a reasonable fan speed. However, dual mining (mining more than one coin at once) does increase power consumption by up to 20%, and there are also idiots who run their polaris cards OCd while mining. With the exception of a few idiots, miners treat their Polaris GPUs pretty much the same; that is, running underclocked and undervolted 24/7 with a memory strap mod and mem OC. On the other hand, former gaming cards are highly variable in use cases. Some gamers leave their cards at stock settings, some undervolt, and some OC and/or overvolt. Most of the time, these cards are thermal cycled far more often than mining cards, which is known to weaken solder. Another thing to consider is that manufacturers have learned (somewhat) from their mistakes of putting shit tier fans in GPUs, and many fans on modern GPUs are ball bearing and/or swappable. Even some budget cards, such as MSI Armor, use decent ball bearing fans. Bottom line: the risk of buying mined Polaris cards is not as high as the risk of buying older mined cards. I would not be against buying mined polaris cards, but it's not necessarily better than buying a gamer's card instead. At the end of the day, it depends more on how the owner treated it than what they used it for.
Myth: GPUs are obsolete because of FPGAs and ASICs Fact: Mostly false. Older algorithms such as scrypt and SHA256 (lite/doge/feathebitcoin etc) are no longer feasible to mine with GPUs, but there have been multiple algorithms since then that are built to deter ASICs; most of the time it is done by making it memory-hard because designing an ASIC with high memory throughput is considerably more expensive to design and manufacture. Many devs prefer their blockchain to be ASIC resistant to avoid the concentration of power problem that Bitcoin is having nowadays, where a giant, near-monopolistic ASIC manufacturer (Bitmain) is causing a lot of (subjective) controversy. Blockchains based on ethash (Ethereum and its forks), equihash (Zcash and its forks) and cryptonight (Monero and forks) are some examples, but there are scores of other shitcoins and a few other algos that are GPU dominant. It is almost impossible that there will be another ASIC takeover, which is what was responsible for the stop in GPU demand in the bitcoin and litecoin days. Bottom line: ASICs no longer threaten GPU miners, or the demand for GPUs
Myth: Ethereum switching to Proof of Stake will kill mining soon Fact: Doomsayers have been preaching about proof of stake since late 2015. It has always been "coming soon." The fact is, the Ethereum roadmap goes from proof of work (mining) -> Casper (mining + PoS) -> Metropolis (PoS). Currently, the release date of Casper is not even announced yet, nor is it being tested in a (public) testnet. Proof of Stake might one day take over, but mining is here to stay for a while yet. Another thing to consider is that there are tons of other GPU mineable blockchains, and although Ethereum is biggest, it is certainly feasible that mining stays profitable even after Ethereum goes PoS (if it ever does). However, it is possible that profits will be low enough to discourage new miners. Bottom line: It's very unlikely. E: I screwed up the roadmap; here is a better source than me with some interesting information: https://www.ethnews.com/ethereums-vitalik-buterin-gives-keynote-on-metropolis
Myth: The current Ethereum demand spike is a bubble Opinion: Honestly, I don't know. I would not be surprised if stricter regulations on ICOs come sooner or later, which would fuck with Ether prices. There is also the inherent volatility of cryptocurrencies. However, it is also possible that blockchain technology continues to gain traction; that is, the price could just as easily go up as go down. Although it's fun to read about other people's opinions, only time-travelling wizards can tell you when it will become economical again to upgrade your poor HD5770. Bottom line: No one knows.
Myth: Miners will "steal" all the RX Vegas Fact: Only a reckless miner would buy Vegas on release, since mining performance is not known. In fact, it is possible that it can't mine at all (or at some stupidly low speed) until devs add support to existing miners. It would be even more reckless than gamers who buy without seeing benchmarks, since at least gamers can expect the games to actually run. It's also not necessarily the case that Vega will be good once miners do add support. Maybe there will be enough reckless miners to affect supply, maybe not. Of course, it is possible that miners will deplete the supply after it is demonstrated that Vega is good for mining. Bottom line: Most miners won't preorder, but it's possible that a significant number will. E: Important to remember that even if mining demand isn't high, doesn't mean that supply will be plentiful.
Myth: Nvidia cards SUCK at mining Fact: Mostly false. They USED to suck in the old pre-Maxwell days, but now they are actually more efficient at mining Ethereum and Zcash compared to AMD cards, even after both cards are undervolted. The flipside is that they (used to) cost more for the equivalent hashrate. For reference, my old 5xRX470 rig drew just under 800W when mining ETH only and hashed at 150MH/s. My current 6xGTX1060 rig draws just over half of that (<450W) and hashes at about 135MH/s. Certainly not as good in raw performance, but they are viable nonetheless, especially given the AMD GPU shortage. In fact, Nvidia cards (1060 and especially 1070) are becoming scarce as well. Bottom line: Nvidia is still the underdog when it comes to mining, but far from irrelevant nowadays.
Myth: 4GB cards will be obsolete for mining soon Fact: FALSE. The Ethereum DAG is not even 3GB yet, and won't be for a few months. The recent reports of 4GB Polaris cards slowing down soon due to DAG size is caused by limited TLB capacity, not VRAM restrictions. Polaris cards will still be able to mine ETH forks such as Expanse and UBIQ without diminished speed, and even if they are used to mine ETH, it is not that much of a performance hit at first. It would certainly not make polaris useless or undesirable for mining anytime soon. Tahiti GPUs already suffer from this issue and Hawaii is the most resistant to this issue. Have not benched Nvidia at a later epoch.
Myth: Creating miner-bashing posts on Reddit will help alleviate the GPU supply problem Fact: False, you are simply giving cryptocurrencies and mining more exposure to the general public, increasing demand.
Myth: Mining-specific GPUs will solve the shortage problems Opinion: There's not enough info to tell yet, but I am a skeptic for the following reasons. First, no display limits the resale value of the card for obvious reasons. IMO, the whole point of crypto mining from a profitability standpoint is to have a hedge against coin volatility (hardware is still worth something if the coin crashes). Otherwise it is much less effort to just buy and hold the coin. If the hardware is useless without demand from other (significant) sources, then it doesn't make much sense to buy it unless the price is extremely low. I'm sure that cost-downing the PCB and warranty will make for a cheap card, but it has to be extremely cheap and plentiful in supply, or else miners will buy whatever they can get. I could envision "failed" chips (not meeting spec of consumer editions) being stuck in miner cards, but I doubt there are enough to meet demand without ramping up production as a whole, which carries its own risks. I guess that it would help a little, but probably not solve the problems. Alternatively, since modern GPUs are bottlenecked by RAM when mining, it might be enticing to miners to have the fastest (GDDR5) RAM on the market (probably the 9gbps chips from the 1060 6G 9gbps edition, although I don't have one to test). However, my previous points still apply; buying such a card without display outputs carries a big risk. Bottom line: It's not a great idea, unless they are super cheap or use really good RAM.
Hope this helped; if you have any further questions I will try to answer them. I'm both a gamer and miner who uses both AMD and Nvidia roughly equally and don't favor one group over another. I've mined and gamed on all high end AMD GPUs since Tahiti (except Tonga) and all Pascal cards except 1050ti.
submitted by key_smash to Amd [link] [comments]

Electroneum Fork 324500

Source: https://www.facebook.com/electroneum/posts/2030562537205714
Hi Everyone!
ALL ELECTRONEUM NODE OWNERS MUST UPDATE THEIR SOFTWARE BY BLOCK 324500 (approx. 36 hours from now – this is an URGENT UPDATE – PLEASE SHARE THIS INFORMATION)
We have an urgent software update below for anyone who runs a full Electroneum Node. If you don’t know what a node is , don’t worry! You won’t need to do anything.
We also have a VERY exciting update about an upcoming listing on a top 10 exchange.
How will I mine Electroneum after this update?
Instant Payment vendor API is open for BETA applicants.How can ETN change the world?
Please note that nothing in this message refers to MOBILE MINING – we are referring to the underlying blockchain miners.
Urgent Electroneum Node / RPC / Command Line Wallet Update
ALL ELECTRONEUM NODE OWNERS MUST UPDATE THEIR SOFTWARE BY BLOCK 324500 (approx. 36 hours from now – this is an URGENT UPDATE – PLEASE SHARE THIS INFORMATION)
https://github.com/electron…/electroneum/releases/…/v2.1.0.0
It’s only been a few short days since I made a video and said “our fork went well! We’re ready for 20m Users!”.
The fork was a great success, from a technical standpoint. Unfortunately, we never got back the number of GPU miners that are needed to ensure our network runs smoothly and has stable block emission. A new phenomenon has emerged where a number of users are mining Electroneum in waves. They come on and then leave after a few hours in a coordinated manner to mine ETN in a completely selfish way. We can’t blame people for maximizing their profit, but we have not built up the amount of “hashing power” that is required to make this impossible and create the stability we need in the network.
This has left us at risk. As such, we have to take urgent action to stabilise our network and protect the Electroneum community.
Coinbene Listing Electroneum & our network stability
We have formally agreed and signed contracts to be listed in July on the AWESOME, top 10, cryptocurrency exchange https://Coinbene.com & https://Coinbene.com.br
Coinbene have 1.5m active users and are a GREAT fit for Electroneum. Their primary markets are Latin America and Asia – which fits perfectly with Electroneum’s customer base. They have seen enormous growth over the last few months and have been very positive about the Electroneum Project.
Whilst this is great news, we will need much more hashing power to ensure we have network stability for our listing on this exchange, so we’ve taken the decision that we can’t wait any longer for GPU miners to return to us and we must run an urgent software update to re-introduce ASIC mining to Electroneum.
This is a very positive move for Electroneum. A great deal of Bitcoin’s trust and appeal is from the enormous hashing power and distribution of miners on the network. Bitcoin & LiteCoin have embraced ASICs and we feel that it is the right thing for Electroneum to do the same.
ASICS are becoming more prevalent, they cost considerably less to run than a GPU rig and use a fraction of the electricity. We are going to encourage more ASIC ownership and take our hashing rate up to (and beyond) the enormous levels of hashing power that we had before the May fork.
There is a further development. The first generation of hardware called an FPGA miner is arriving during 2018 and they make ANTI-ASIC capabilities a thing of the past, as they circumvent the slow delivery time of new ASICs by being re-programmable. If we are ready to embrace these rather than fight them, our network hashing power is increased further and our network stability and security is further enhanced.
Because ASICS run cooler, quieter and use a fraction of GPU rig power, they are suitable for MORE people to run in their homes. If you are interested, a search of “Cryptonight ASIC miner” in Google or Ebay will find the equipment needed to mine Electroneum. You will need to be reasonably technical to achieve this!
Having a stable network is absolutely key to both delivering mass adoption and to ensure we have a great relationship with the great exchanges that we’re already listed with, and to encourage more of the larger exchanges to see Electroneum as a coin that they want on board.
How will I mine Electroneum after this update?
If you are a mobile miner – nothing changes. If you are a GPU or ASIC miner then you’ll need to connect to an Electroneum pool but it is important to note that you will need to change your ALGORITHM. You MUST use the algorithm “Cryptonight” and NOT “Electroneum” or “CryptonightV7”. This will ensure your device works after the update. We will communicate this to all pools, but if you are a member of a mining pool – PLEASE LET THE ADMINS KNOW ABOUT THIS CRITICAL UPDATE. They must update their pool node by block 324500, which is only around 36 hours away.
Instant Payment vendor API is open for BETA applicants
Instant Cryptocurrency Payments via smart phone has always been a critical part of what Electroneum required to achieve mass market adoption. It’s never been done, but 9 short months after our ICO we are excited to announce that we have opened to the doors to vendors who would like to accept payment via Electroneum. The application is to be part of the BETA rollout of instant payment, but will operate on the live blockchain with real ETN!
If you run a business or know someone who does – why not recommend they apply to accept ETN. The Press and Marketing opportunities for the first, in any sector, to accept cryptocurrency are huge! Be part of the instant payment API BETA program by completing this form:
https://docs.google.com/…/1FAIpQLSfKTwWT7W4ltmApZO…/viewform
How can ETN change the world?
Instant payment does far more than allow people to pay for their coffee with crypto instead of their VISA card.
If you’d like to know more about Electroneum’s future I suggest you read a fantastic article that describes its coming role in the world, by fellow director Chris Gorman OBE (Officer of the British Empire – awarded by the Queen of England!): https://www.linkedin.com/…/how-cryptocurrency-enable-financ…
Electroneum has one of the largest of all cryptocurrency communities and it is made up of passionate and amazing people. With your support and world changing things we have coming out over the next few weeks, we can use this update to make our blockchain foundation secure and lead the world in mobile cryptocurrency.
I'm sure you agree that we've been through some challenging times which our team have always dealt with and learned from. The strength and support from our community and many of our goals becoming a reality combined with this blockchain update will give us the perfect foundation to deliver the Electroneum vision that we all share.
Thanks for taking the time to read this long message.
Have a great day everyone,
Richard Ells
Founder, Electroneum.com
submitted by MulatuTesh to Electroneum [link] [comments]

Mining ERC-918 Tokens (0xBitcoin)

GENERAL INFORMATION

0xBitcoin (0xBTC) is the first mineable ERC20 token on Ethereum. It uses mining for distribution, unlike all previous ERC20 tokens which were assigned to the contract deployer upon creation. 0xBTC is the first implementation of the EIP918 mineable token standard (https://eips.ethereum.org/EIPS/eip-918), which opened up the possibility of a whole new class of mineable assets on Ethereum. Without any ICO, airdrop, pre-mine, or founder’s reward, 0xBitcoin is arguably the most decentralized asset in the Ethereum ecosystem, including even Ether (ETH), which had a large ICO.
The goal of 0xBitcoin is to be looked at as a currency and store of value asset on Ethereum. Its 21 million token hard cap and predictable issuance give it scarcity and transparency in terms of monetary policy, both things that Ether lacks. 0xBitcoin has certain advantages over PoW based currencies, such as compatibility with smart contracts and decentralized exchanges. In addition, 0xBTC cannot be 51% attacked (without attacking Ethereum), is immune from the “death spiral”, and will receive the benefits of scaling and other improvements to the Ethereum network.

GETTING 0xBITCOIN TOKENS

0xBitcoin can be mined using typical PC hardware, traded on exchanges (either decentralized or centralized) or purchased from specific sites/contracts.

-Mined using PC hardware

-Traded on exchanges such as


MINING IN A NUTSHELL

0xBitcoin is a Smart Contract on the Ethereum network, and the concept of Token Mining is patterned after Bitcoin's distribution. Rather than solving 'blocks', work is issued by the contract, which also maintains a Difficulty which goes up or down depending on how often a Reward is issued. Miners can put their hardware to work to claim these rewards, in concert with specialized software, working either by themselves or together as a Pool. The total lifetime supply of 0xBitcoin is 21,000,000 tokens and rewards will repeatedly halve over time.
The 0xBitcoin contract was deployed by Infernal_Toast at Ethereum address: 0xb6ed7644c69416d67b522e20bc294a9a9b405b31
0xBitcoin's smart contract, running on the Ethereum network, maintains a changing "Challenge" (that is generated from the previous Ethereum block hash) and an adjusting Difficulty Target. Like traditional mining, the miners use the SoliditySHA3 algorithm to solve for a Nonce value that, when hashed alongside the current Challenge and their Minting Ethereum Address, is less-than-or-equal-to the current Difficulty Target. Once a miner finds a solution that satisfies the requirements, they can submit it into the contract (calling the Mint() function). This is most often done through a mining pool. The Ethereum address that submits a valid solution first is sent the 50 0xBTC Reward.
(In the case of Pools, valid solutions that do not satisfy the full difficulty specified by the 0xBitcoin contract, but that DO satisfy the Pool's specified Minimum Share Difficulty, get a 'share'. When one of the Miners on that Pool finds a "Full" solution, the number of shares each miner's address has submitted is used to calculate how much of the 50 0xBTC reward they will get. After a Reward is issued, the Challenge changes.
A Retarget happens every 1024 rewards. In short, the Contract tries to target an Average Reward Time of about 60 times the Ethereum block time. So (at the time of this writing):
~13.9 seconds \* 60 = 13.9 minutes
If the average Reward Time is longer than that, the difficulty will decrease. If it's shorter, it will increase. How much longer or shorter it was affects the magnitude with which the difficulty will rise/drop, to a maximum of 50%. * Click Here to visit the stats page~ (https://0x1d00ffff.github.io/0xBTC-Stats) to see recent stats and block times, feel free to ask questions about it if you need help understanding it.

MINING HARDWARE

Presently, 0xBitcoin and "Alt Tokens" can be mined on GPUs, CPUs, IGPs (on-CPU graphics) and certain FPGAs. The most recommended hardware is nVidia graphics cards for their efficiency, ubiquity and relatively low cost. As general rules, the more cores and the higher core frequency (clock) you can get, the more Tokens you will earn!
Mining on nVidia cards:
Mining on AMD cards:
Mining on IGPs (e.g. AMD Radeon and Intel HD Graphics):
Clocks and Power Levels:

MINING SOFTWARE AND DESCRIPTIONS

For the most up-to-date version info, download links, thread links and author contact information, please see this thread: https://www.reddit.com/0xbitcoin/comments/8o06dk/links_to_the_newestbest_miners_for_nvidia_amd/ Keep up to date for the latest speed, stability and feature enhancements!
COSMiC Miner by LtTofu:
SoliditySha3Miner by Amano7:
AIOMiner All-In-One GPU Miner:
TokenMiner by MVis (Mining-Visualizer):
"Nabiki"/2.10.4 by Azlehria:
~Older Miners: Older and possibly-unsupported miner versions can be found at the above link for historical purposes and specific applications- including the original NodeJS CPU miner by Infernal Toast/Zegordo, the '1000x' NodeJS/C++ hybrid version of 0xBitcoin-Miner and Mikers' enhanced CUDA builds.

FOR MORE INFORMATION...

If you have any trouble, the friendly and helpful 0xBitcoin community will be happy to help you out. Discord has kind of become 0xBTC's community hub, you can get answers the fastest from devs and helpful community members. Or message one of the community members on reddit listed below.
Links
submitted by GeoffedUP to gpumining [link] [comments]

Ritocoin - a 100% community driven project based on Ravencoin


tl:dr: Ritocoin is a code fork of the Ravencoin codebase and continues to track future Ravencoin developments. The project was launched to provide a more community-oriented blockchain with the same functionality as Ravencoin, without a corporate overseer, and with a more flexible model for community participation and development. It’s intention is to be a hacker’s playground for innovative ideas.

Specifications

Proof-of-Work Algorithm: X21S
Block Time: 60 seconds
POW Block Reward: Smooth curve down
Community fund: 1% first year
Difficulty Retargeting: DGW-180
Maximum Supply:
6 months: 993,521,892 RITO
1 year: 1,227,448,858 RITO
5 years: 1,762,210,058 RITO
10 years: 1,820,404,381 RITO
50 years: 2,030,907,256 RITO
100 years: 2,293,707,246 RITO
Infinite: 10 RITO per block in perpetuity

Pre-mine: None
Masternodes: Researching for use case
Asset layer: Was enabled at height 50,000

Links
Website
/ritocoin
Explorer
Github
Whitepaper
twitter
[ANN]

X21S

This hashing algorithm was created specifically for Ritocoin, and was designed to resist FPGAs, ASICs, and NiceHash. It is X16S (16 algorithms shuffled and hashed),, followed by 5 additional hashing algorithms: haval256, tiger, lyra2, gost512, and sha256. The inclusion of lyra2 brings numerous advantages, making parallelization of the algorithm practically impossible, with each step relying on the previous step having already been computed. It is a “friendly” algorithm that makes GPUs produce much less heat and uses less electricity during mining.

Take your time to learn more about us in the below story of Ritocoin...

The spirit of Bitcoin continues to inspire, empower and enable people around the globe. Ten years later, just as it seemed Bitcoin was being defined by commercial agents and regulated governance, that same free and independent spirit imbued the Ravencoin community. In ten short months, however, 30% of the Ravencoin project’s net hash comes from NiceHash and the looming impact of the imminent FPGA mining cards and X16R bitstreams certainly promises to shake up the dream of this GPU miner’s darling.

Ravencoin’s fair launch genuinely inspired our developers and supporters. We admire the way Ravencoin came out swinging — fighting for fairness, an honest distribution of coins and a place where GPU miners could thrive. The asset layer attracted many more miners and investors to the pools. Many Ritocoin enthusiasts came from the Ravencoin community, and continue their association with that project.

The whole crypto ecosystem should appreciate the work begun by Ravencoin. Obviously they continue to inspire and motivate us to this day. It’s the reason we took action. We decided to start our own project which focuses upon at least two pillars of decentralized networks in the crypto space: community governance and a fair distribution of coins. It is a core belief throughout Ritocoin that in order to successfully develop and maintain this hacker’s playground — a place where a broad range of ideas could be tried and allowed to flourish — these two ideals must be allowed to drive and guide our community.

This deep focus on community choices creates a project flexible enough to support most ideas, and agile enough to define new frontiers.

A mining network’s distributed ledger is defined by its technology. Like many in the broader crypto-mining community, we value the GPU for its accessibility. These processors are available for purchase all around the world without any legal restrictions. GPUs are vastly more accessible for hobbyists and miners to acquire. They can be shipped nearly anywhere around the globe, a nice benefit to the popular secondary market which has sprung up much to the chagrin of PC gamers.

More constraints exist for the ASIC and FPGA miner. Laws in some parts of the world restrict people from using or buying ASIC and FPGA mining hardware. This alone is directly in confrontation with Ritocoin’s core values of decentralized stewardship and sovereignty.

The GPU, in essence, is like your voice. Anyone with the means of acquiring one GPU should be able to have their voice heard. ASIC and FPGA mining devalues the GPU miner’s voice and silos that coin’s network away from the small scale and personal mining operator. A truly community driven project means each stakeholder, regardless of size of contribution to the network’s net hash, has an opportunity to build, vote and direct.

If you are already familiar with our website, discord or whitepaper, you are probably aware that masternodes had been proposed as a feature of the network from the beginning. This opened the door to ongoing discussions in the Ritocoin community regarding

● A masternode’s true purpose

● What benefit they provide to the project

● How the benefit is realized

● The collateral

This discussion, governed entirely by stakeholders across the extended network yielded a defining moment for our vision of flexibility. We have not yet found the potential utility of masternodes, however, the conversation has not reached an extent to where we could abandon the idea. To quote one of our developers during this discussion on our Discord:

“Just want to give a reminder here that even though masternodes are on the roadmap, it is not set in stone. This coin belongs to the community and we will do what we as a community want to do. If we conclude that we want to take this coin a different direction than masternodes, then that is what we’ll do.” --traysi

We are all volunteers at Ritocoin. Our moderators and community leaders try to give immediate support to all users that require it. Contact us in Discord or Telegram, not only for support, but, proposing new ideas, revising old ones and just so you can find a place to get together and find people to hang out with. You are well within your rights to enjoy yourself at any given moment, and, should you feel so inclined to begin working with the team, we just so happen to be looking for ambitious individuals that see themselves as being part of a greater vision, are inspired by change, and inspired to be the change they want to see making things better in this world.

Join us in a space where your ideas to build something great can become a reality. We are eager to know what you think is best for the future of Rito. What steps would you take to become more resilient, stronger, fair and decentralized? Because at the end of the day, like it or not, love it or leave it.. this is your coin, too.

You can become a significant part of this project. We will help you further develop the role you wish to fill in the cryptocurrency space — influencer, developer, analyst, you name it. This is not a just-for-developer’s playground. We want the enthusiasts. We want the perplexed and the rabbit-hole divers. This is the coin for everyone who is trying to find their place on the path that Satoshi began unfolding in 2008 after the collapse of the housing market rippled out into the subsequent crash of global markets. That’s why we have Bitcoin, remember? Be your own bank. This is why Satoshi and Bitcoin.org kept their software open source. It’s up to us to keep the torch ablaze.

Community funds

For the first year, about 1% of mined coins are set aside into a developers fund that is used to provide bounties to the community developers who make substantial development contributions to the Ritocoin ecosystem. We have already paid out numerous bounties for important work that has already benefits Ritocoin in substantial ways. We also have another donation-driven community fund that has recently been put together for the purposes of doing fun contests and things like that.

Cooperation and collaborations

We have discovered a number of fatal flaws in the original Ravencoin codebase and worked with the Ravencoin developers to get those fixed in both Ritocoin and Ravencoin. This work has benefitted Ravencoin in numerous ways and we look forward to a long time of collaboration and cooperation between us and them. Many members of the Safecoin team are also in our discord group, and have collaborated with us in shaping the future decisions of Ritocoin. We have several thousand members in our group and they represent all walks of cryptocurrency life. We invite all coin developers, miners and enthusiasts to join our discord and be a part of this coin that truly belongs entirely to the community.

Block reward

A couple weeks ago we met for a scheduled meeting in our discord group and had a lengthy conversation about the block reward. Our block reward started at 5,000 RITO per block (every 60 seconds) just like Ravencoin. This extremely high number of coins coupled with the high profitability of mining led to unforeseen consequences with pools auto-exchanging the coin into bitcoin. This dumping by non-community miners had a very negative impact on the community sentiment and morale, as we watched the exchange price plunge. We looked at other coins and realized that this fate has befell many other coins with high block rewards. Following much discussion, we decided to change the reward structure. Starting around March 19th the block rewards will start to slowly go down in a curve until it reaches 1,000. Then the reduction will be even more slowed down with block rewards exponentially dropping at periodic intervals. We have posted charts on our website that shows what the long-term effects of our reward reducing algorithms will be. As a miner, the next 2 months will be a great time to mine and hold, while the block reward is still fairly high. We encourage all miners and cryptocurrency enthusiasts to take advantage of the current favourable block reward and build a nice holding for yourself. Then join the community and be a part of the fun we’re having with this project.
This post was prepared by a collaboration of multiple Ritocoin members and was posted to reddit by the core developer Trevali, who posts to reddit under the ritocoin username and will be very happy to answer any questions anybody may have about our project. Traysi (well known in the Ravencoin community) is also an active Ritocoin developer and may come to this thread if needed.
We welcome any questions from any of you regarding our project!
submitted by ritocoin to gpumining [link] [comments]

BitcoinSOV (BSOV) Trading is Coming to Resfinex on 08 Feb 2020.

Dear Users,
We are pleased to announce that BitcoinSOV (BSOV) will be listed on 08th Feb 2020.
What is BitcoinSOV (BSOV)?
BitcoinSOV is a 100% community-driven cryptocurrency, and does not rely on centralized decision makers or traditional power structures to survive. This deflationary grassroots movement is built from the bottom-up, and is fully reliant on people like you to build it. We use non-violent methods of action — we fight for financial independence, and freedom from inflation.
What time will funding and trading start?
Trading Pairs
Confirmations required before deposits credit
Fees
BSOV stats
Trade with caution
Thanks for your support,
Resfinex Team
Invest with caution
Listing an asset or token for trade is not a recommendation to buy, sell, or participate in the associated network. Do your own research and invest at your own risk.
submitted by resfinex_official to u/resfinex_official [link] [comments]

Profitable Crypto Mining: ASIC vs GPU, Which One Is Better?

Profitable Crypto Mining: ASIC vs GPU, Which One Is Better?
If you’re new to mining you probably have multiple questions running through your head right now. Good news is that it gets easier with time, assuming that you do your homework and research, and we will try to help you out.
One of the common questions is whether one should choose GPU or ASIC mining and we definitely have some advice on that topic.
When we’re considering classic POW mining we can quickly rule out CPU hardware for not being efficient and FPGA hardware because of its high costs. This leaves you with ASIC and GPU to choose from.

https://preview.redd.it/igev3y4v8pv31.png?width=1920&format=png&auto=webp&s=2a0c9271fc36252181d086e74101d13875619c80

Buying Mining Equipment

Let’s get things straight — you won’t be able to buy ASIC devices in any of you local electronic shops, even in the biggest ones. There are two ways you can get this hardware: buying it online which shouldn’t be a problem these days unless that’s the newest model you’re after. Second option is to find a local company that sells ASIC equipment.
Also, you can try to purchase the equipment directly from the manufacture company, however, mind the huge customs and delivery fees if the company is located abroad.
It is highly recommended to test ASICs before buying them to make sure the equipment works properly.
GPU or graphics cards and other equipment that you will need to build your very own mining farm can be easily purchased at a regular computer store. The only problem you may have is getting the right set of hardware, so make sure to come prepared.
When buying a used (second-hand) graphics card don’t forget to test it.
What’s better?
If you’re not into hardware and have no clue how to set up a farm by yourself buying ASIC equipment would be a better option as you won’t need to build anything yourself.

Warranty Policy

In general, an official warranty policy for ASIC hardware is up to 180 days since the equipment was shipped to the buyer. When the seller is confident about the quality of their equipment, they can offer their personal 1 month warranty.
When you’re buying computer hardware in most of the cases you are getting full 2 year warranty policy including exchange or repairments of the equipment.
What’s better?
Warranty policy is especially important when you have no chance to check the equipment yourself or when you’re buying large inventory of it. Also, if you plan to go with overclocking, you will probably need a decent warranty as well.
We need to add that when you’re using the equipment accordingly and conduct regular maintenance both ASIC and GPU can work past the warranty period.

Setting Up Process

With ASICs it’s simple: you plug and connect it, pick a pool to join and start mining right away.
With GPU, it’s a little complicated. First, you need to build your farm. You will need a framework, motherboard with installed CPU and cooling, storage unit, power supply, risers and video cards. If you have no experience with assembling computer hardware you’re gonna need to save some time and prepare to put extra effort. Once your rig is ready you will have to install OS and optimize it which is usually even harder than setting up a rig. But luckily we’ve got a solution for that. CoinFly can do the work for you and help you with setting up and optimizing your equipment.
What’s better?
Although ASICs are very easy, you shouldn’t quickly give up on GPU mining. If assembling computer hardware is not a big problem for you, CoinFly will help you with setting it up.

Maintenance

ASIC equipment won’t give you too much trouble: it’s safe, stable, and doesn’t require any special knowledge. Maintenance includes cleaning off dust and oiling the fans.
When dealing with rigs, you will have to work a little harder and study the basics about at least graphics cards’ temperatures and operational frequency. A stable workflow depends heavily on the software and as it has a tendency to fail, it could become a problem. Unless you’re using CoinFly — our system will notify you in case of emergency so you can tune your equipment online.
What’s better?
Once again, when it comes to maintaining ASICs are almost trouble-free. GPU rigs are a bit tricky but when using the right tools like CoinFly to monitor their work, it can serve you just fine.

The Noise

ASICs are loud: when you’re in a room with a working ASIC you’re gonna need to shout, so people can hear you.
GPU farms have no such problem. Some of them are almost silent and that doesn’t affect the cooling process at all.
What’s better?
Maybe the level of noise your equipment makes was not the first issue on your list but we recommend you to consider it. ASICs are suitable only for the commercial and industrial premises.

Mining

ASICs can work with only one algorithm and mine one or several types of cryptocurrencies and are perfect for mining Bitcoin and its forks.
GPU rigs are universal: you can mine a huge variety of coins if you set your miner right.
What’s better?
If you want to mine Bitcoin, you gotta go with ASIC. But think again if that’s what you’re really after. After all, you can choose mining any altcoin that you’d like with your GPU rig and then simply exchange it to BTC. And if you’re lucky enough to mine a coin that will do good ASICs do not give you that choice, however, their mining capability is higher.

Relevance of the Equipment

ASICs are quickly getting out of date as the new models come along. Back in the day, the new versions used to come out every half a year and they were 10 times more efficient. In general, you need to change your ASIC hardware every year.
GPU equipment can perfectly serve you for 2 to 3 years and if you wish to sell the graphics card afterwards that wouldn’t be a problem either.
What’s better?
In terms of relevance, it’s probably reasonable to go with the GPU.

Return on Investment

In the long run, the profitableness of ASICs is higher but because the new models are being released quite frequently you cannot expect huge profits. It is always important to do your research and get the most relevant equipment.
GPU hardware will take its time to pay you back but it also depends if you manage to find the right coin to mine that will eventually increase your profits.
What’s better?
ASIC mining is definitely a good option for those who don’t want to constantly monitor the crypto market.
But in the case that you’re interested in what’s happening in the crypto space and you also have time to do your own research, the GPU farm would the better choice. If you’re not willing to spend your efforts on that, CoinFly Autopilot mode will help you mine the most profitable coin on the market automatically.

Conclusion

ASICs are great for people who can provide a non-residential space for mining and not willing to spend too much time and effort for setting up the equipment and stay updated with the latest trends in the crypto industry.
GPU rigs are suitable for mining at home and won’t scare away all the crypto and computer enthusiasts. If you’re just starting your mining journey but not sure how to do it, we recommend to register on CoinFly. From setting up your hardware to tuning it online and picking the best coin to mine at the moment — we’ve got you covered!
submitted by coinfly to CoinFly [link] [comments]

Some rational thinking (and numbers) on ASICs/Dedicated Hardware

The current ETH price is bad - we can all clearly see that, having dropped to almost 25% of ATH. So over that period of time miners have lost 75% of their profits + the difficulty increases.
The current difficulty HAS started slowing/plateauing. Just zoom in on that etherscan.io graph for Oct-Present and that is obvious.
Current difficulty is 265 TH/s or so. That’s about 10 MILLION GPUs @ 26 MH average.
The looming fear has been this idea that Dedicated hardware (regardless of ASIC/FPGA/Custom GPUs) are going to completely destroy mining in the near term. I’m here to loudly say that’s a bunch of FUD. Here is my reasoning.
  1. The rumors peg F3 hashrates between 250 and 600 MH for $3000-$6000. $3000-7500 would get you about the same range with commodity GPUs (if you bargain shop and are efficient building rigs). Initial cost is maybe a 10-20% advantage. Those buying used cards get that deal now.
  2. Power usage rumored are 750w or so. Commodity rig with the same GPU power 1200-2400W. So maybe 3x power advantage / operating cost. At $0.10/kW that amounts to $120/mo of savings in the best case, and the 600 MH is currently worth $520 or so at these depressed prices. So you make 23% more.
  3. Next gen GPUs using GDDR6 will almost certainly double hashrates. Without going into the details, it is sufficient to say GDDR6 will double memory bandwidth for all classes of GPUs using it and thus will almost certainly double hashrate for the same power. A major memory change like this hasn’t happened in more than 5 years. Mining has basically never seen it. This should narrow or eliminate any dedicated hardware gap, even if it doesn’t help current card investments... but those are still pretty safe, see #4.
  4. ASIC/Dedicated production is super unlikely to make any significant dent in difficulty for a while. Let’s say the batch size is an extremely aggressive 5,000 units a week, each producing the output of 20 typical GPUs. That’s the same as 100,000 GPUs being introduced a week - but that would only be a 1.1% difficulty increase per week. It would take two years of ASICs for difficulty to double and your $520/mo to drop to $260 - assuming ETH price remained constant. Meanwhile over 4 million GPUs came online between December and January - Thats 10x more new GPU miners per week than Bitmain production could have supported brining online.
You aren’t competing against ASICs. You’re competing against price, which is partially dropping due to all this FUD and uncertainty about ASICs, and you are competing with the millions of get rich quick miners that started, with their GPUs, this spring.
For reference bitcoin ASICs, and other not-ASIC resistant algorithms compete with ASIC systems that are 1-100 orders of magnitude faster for cost/power than the GPU miners. That is NOT the case here, we’re looking at 20-30% savings and only till the next gen of GPUs, and this is why ETH has met its project goal of being ASIC resistant - which does not mean it is impossible to build dedicated hardware to mine ETH, it simply means that such hardware won’t change the landscape.
Bitcoin was also much smaller than ETH in terms of number of GPUs mining when ASICs were introduced, which is why a relatively low volume of ASIC production that were orders of magnitude better than GPUs resulted in such a disruption to Bitcoin mining. The same holds true of the much smaller coins that were being dual mined.
In summary - you are losing profits because of FUD and market shifts lowering price, and that will continue to be why you’re losing money - not ASICs or dedicated hardware. The sooner the community stops running around like chickens with their heads cut off and realigns with focusing on the goals for Ethereum itself, the sooner the situation and price will stabilize. Besides, POS is always coming eventually...
submitted by GPUHoarder to EtherMining [link] [comments]

I own 179 BTC, here is my story

I am not a wealthy person by any means, but Bitcoin has helped.
I discovered Bitcoin via a post on overclock.net on April 27th, 2011. I believe the price was about $1.50/coin then. I read the posts about people mining them, did some research, and immediately started my Radeon card mining them. I had a 4770 back then.
There was an exchange to sell Bitcoins for linden dollars (Second Life currency) and then I could sell those for paypal dollars. Within a day I had proven to my wife that I could make money with this Bitcoin thing. Despite us being in a position where we couldn't even pay our credit cards, I took the $1100 we had and bought 4 5850's, some power supplies, and some cheap craigslist computers. I figured that if this whole Bitcoin thing failed miserably, at least I had some decent computer hardware I could resell and recover most of the cost. I immediately sold one 5850 for greater-than-market value since they were in demand and I needed the money, and started the other 3 mining. At one point, I was mining nearly 8 coins a day. I bought a few more cards as time went on and continued GPU mining for as long as it was viable.
This whole thing saved us financially. I was able to sell the Bitcoins and settle on my unpayable credit card debts. I held on to a few during the crash but managed to sell most of them at $10 or more, fortunately. After that I started saving them, since they were worth so little. I bought some of the early BFL FPGA miners, the ones that were measured in MHashes not GHashes. After mining with those for a while and then selling them to someone who wanted them more than I did, I had more than 450 BTC. I took the plunge and pre-ordered BFL's latest offerings, the 60GH singles, the day they were available, becoming one of the first on the preorder list. Little did I know I would have been much better off just holding those coins...
Regardless, I did eventually receive those singles, and managed to get about 225 BTC out of them before they were no longer worth running. I've been slowly selling the stash as we needed for remodel projects around the house and for miscellaneous expenses, though I finally no longer need to do so, as we've been able to pay off more debts and have more income than expenses each month. Now I've got a nice pile of savings, and I'm hoping to someday be able to use it to buy a better house in a better neighborhood.
I generally don't tell people that I have just about all my liquid assets in Bitcoin, as they would call me crazy. They might be right. But it's a risk I'm willing to take. I do have some equity in my house, and some retirement accounts, but neither is worth more than my BTC stash.
So that's MY story, what's yours?
submitted by bitcoinzzzz to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

Transcript of Open Developer Meeting In Discord - 5/10/2019

[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs05/10/2019
Channel should be open now
Chill05/10/2019
you all rock!
just getting that out of the way :wink:
Tron05/10/2019
Cheers everyone.
theking05/10/2019
Hi fabulous dev team!
Hans_Schmidt05/10/2019
Howdy!
Tron05/10/2019
No specific agenda today.
Questions?
Has everyone seen Zelcore wallet, and Spend app?
theDopeMedic05/10/2019
Any major development status updates that haven't been listed in #news?
Synicide05/10/2019
How was the meetup yesterday? I heard it would be recorded, it is uploaded anywhere yet?
Tron05/10/2019
And Trezor support on Mango Farm assets?
@Synicide Yes it was recorded. The Bitcoin meetup organizer has the video.
I talked about Ravencoin, but mostly about the stuff that was being built on/with/for Ravencoin.
There was about 70% overlap with folks who were at the Ravencoin meetup in March.
Synicide05/10/2019
awesome, looking forward to watching it when it's available
Tron05/10/2019
I'll hit up James and see if he's posting the video.
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org05/10/2019
@theDopeMedic I'd follow github if youre interested in development status
Synicide05/10/2019
zelcore looks super slick. Been meaning to research its security more with the username/pw being stored on device
Chill05/10/2019
How is the progress on the restricted assets and testnet coming along? A secondary question would be about the approximate fork timeframe.
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org05/10/2019
Has anyone heard from the community dev (BW) working on Dividends?
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor05/10/2019
Any word on BW and his progress w dividends?
@S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org LOL
Tron05/10/2019
@S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org Great question. I haven't heard.
Synicide05/10/2019
last meeting BlondFrogs said he would try to connect with BW as he was sick with the flu at the time. Maybe he has an update
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org05/10/2019
I've tried to get in contact, but with no success.
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor05/10/2019
Got a funny feeling...
Jeroz05/10/2019
Last time we left off with someone mentioning a foundation and Tron saying let’s discuss that next time iirc
kryptoshi05/10/2019
Has anyone taken a look at the merits for this proposal? Thoughts? https://medium.com/systems-nexus/modified-x16r-algorithm-proposal-for-constant-hash-rate-in-short-time-164711dd9044
Medium
Modified X16R algorithm proposal for constant hash rate in short time
Interpretation Lens V. a0.01
Tron05/10/2019
I did see it. Does anyone think this is a problem?
Synicide05/10/2019
It looks interesting... but I'm not sure what it is trying to solve. Looking at netstats, our 1 hour average block time is perfectly 1 minute
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org05/10/2019
Last I heard from him he expressed how important finishing the code was. I wouldnt jump to conclusions on his absence within the community.
Synicide05/10/2019
x16r by nature will fluctuate, but DGW seems to be doing a good job keeping consistent block times
Tron05/10/2019
Because of relatively broad distribution across the algorithms, the block times are fairly consistent. It is possible, but very, very unlikely to get a sequence that takes up to 4x longer, but that's super rare, and only 4 minutes.
We did some timing analysis of the algorithms early on. A few are 1/2 as long as SHA-256 and some are up to 4x longer. But when you randomly select 16 it usually comes out about even.
Synicide05/10/2019
1hr avg: 1.02min - 24hr avg: 1min
I think we should focus on building, and not trying to fix what isnt necessarily broken
Tron05/10/2019
Agreed.
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor05/10/2019
Agreed
Tron05/10/2019
Is everyone ok with the frequency (every other week) of this discussion?
Jeroz05/10/2019
(Added thumbs down to measure)
Tron05/10/2019
@Jeroz Did you do thumbs-up and thumbs down?
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org05/10/2019
Seems appropriate. Its not like the devs dont poke around here and chat anyways.
Tron05/10/2019
Anything critical that we should be aware of?
Jeroz05/10/2019
When I need a dev, I poke a dev. When that dev is unavailable. I poke another one :smiley:
Hans_Schmidt05/10/2019
BlondFrogs was testing some github code last month to create a dividends snapshot database of asset holders at a given blockheight. Is that planned for inclusion? That's the only thing needed for dividends.
Jeroz05/10/2019
I hope I didn’t offend any devs
With poking around
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor05/10/2019
Was thinking voting would be an excellent use case for restricted assets. Local communities, nations, etc... could kyc their residents
radiodub05/10/2019
Is x16r will remain fpga mineable
Tron05/10/2019
@Jeroz We're hard to offend.
Chill05/10/2019
Is the general dev feeling that the next fork should and will include everything needed for the next 6-9 months (barring something completely unforeseen)?
Jeroz05/10/2019
I know :smile:
Tron05/10/2019
@radiodub Nearly impossible to stop FPGAs and still keep GPUs
Jeroz05/10/2019
About that: voting is another hard fork right? Not too soon?
Tron05/10/2019
FPGAs can be reprogrammed as fast. It is silicon (true ASIC) that we can obsolete with a tiny change.
@Jeroz Messaging, voting, Tags, Restricted Assets would require a hard fork (upgrade).
We could do them each individually, but folks get weary of upgrades, so current plan is to roll them together into one.
MrFanelli™05/10/2019
Good idea
Jeroz05/10/2019
Oh voting too?
MrFanelli™05/10/2019
People will like that
Jeroz05/10/2019
I thought that was coming later
Tron05/10/2019
Voting is the one that isn't being worked on now. Tags and Restricted assets have taken precedence.
Jeroz05/10/2019
I know. But you plan on waiting to fork until voting is also done?
That would have my preference tbh
But I can see an issue with too many things at the same time
Tron05/10/2019
If someone wants to step in, we've had one of our devs sidelined and he was working on BlockBook support so more light wallets can connect to Ravencoin. Mostly test cases needed at this point.
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org05/10/2019
Thats a pretty large upgrade.. Bigger surface for unknowns
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor05/10/2019
At what point would RVN community consider moving to ASICs because having a Bitcoin level of security would eventually be needed?
MrFanelli™05/10/2019
Never rikki
Tron05/10/2019
@S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org 100% Lots of testing on testnet and bounties.
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs05/10/2019
I am here :smiley:
Tron05/10/2019
@Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor There's nothing inherently wrong with ASICs but it tends to centralize to data centers and less opportunity for anyone to just run their gaming rig overnight and collect RVN.
Welcome Blondfrogs
MrFanelli™05/10/2019
Asics are too expensive. If we want normal people to mine, then we cant be an asic network
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor05/10/2019
@Tron True but what happens when the chain needs a Bitcoin level of protection?
Tron05/10/2019
More GPUs, more FPGAs
MrFanelli™05/10/2019
Nvidia loves ravencoin :stuck_out_tongue:
Chill05/10/2019
ok, so we are pro FPGAs
𝕿𝖍𝖊 𝕯𝖔𝖓 𝕳𝖆𝖗𝖎𝖘𝖙𝖔 CEO ∞05/10/2019
Build it and they will come
Tron05/10/2019
It's all relative. It is cost to attack. If an ASIC isn't available for rent, then only option is rental of non-allocated GPUs
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor05/10/2019
@Chill Eventually everyone will need FPGAs to be profitable on RVN, at that point I don't see why we just don't make the switch to ASICs
Tron05/10/2019
Also, as much as we don't focus on price, the price does matter because it determines the amount of electricity and hardware will be deployed to get the block reward. Price increase means more security, more mining means more security means higher price.
It's a circle.
Chill05/10/2019
someone tell that to the twitter handler
HailKira05/10/2019
you guys adding seedphrase to desktop wallet?
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs05/10/2019
@HailKira We will, just is not a high priority right now.
MrFanelli™05/10/2019
Twitter handle wants rvn ded
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor05/10/2019
I just don't see much difference between ASIC and FPGA and I'd rather have the added nethash an ASIC will provide once GPUs are virtually kicked off the network
kryptoshi05/10/2019
I'm at 11 GB future proof
Tron05/10/2019
That also limits miners to big money, not gaming rigs.
Synicide05/10/2019
@Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor you have to keep in mind the 'added nethash' is all relative
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor05/10/2019
FPGAs will limit miners to big $$$ too IMO
Tron05/10/2019
@kryptoshi New algo x16r-12G requires 12GB :frowning:
Seal <:cricat:> Clubber05/10/2019
But sperating smaller gb cards would lead to less adoption if we ever become a mainstream coin.
Adpotion of mining that is
Chill05/10/2019
but we are a mainstream coin
Seal <:cricat:> Clubber05/10/2019
Mains stream as in what eth did
Tron05/10/2019
@Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor I agree. Not a perfect solution.
Steelers05/10/2019
Is this a Dev meeting or Algo meeting :smiley:
Seal <:cricat:> Clubber05/10/2019
But if we ever go mem lane. We should aim for 6 or 8gb.
Tron05/10/2019
Open to other questions.
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor05/10/2019
@Tron Probably not the time and the place to have this discussion as we stand currently but IMO we're gonna have this conversation for real eventually
Seal <:cricat:> Clubber05/10/2019
Most cards have 6gb now.
kryptoshi05/10/2019
Why 12 gb ? Such a massive jump
Seal <:cricat:> Clubber05/10/2019
^
Would also like to know
Tron05/10/2019
@kryptoshi I was joking. You said you had 11GB card.
Seal <:cricat:> Clubber05/10/2019
Haha
You got em good
I cant imaghine the face he had when he was 1gb short
Lel
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor05/10/2019
That's what she said
kryptoshi05/10/2019
Hahaha
MrFanelli™05/10/2019
need a 2080ti
Seal <:cricat:> Clubber05/10/2019
How much does the VII have?
16?
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs05/10/2019
Any other questions you have for us?
Hans_Schmidt05/10/2019
@[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs You were testing some github code last month to create a dividends snapshot database of asset holders at a given blockheight. Is that planned for inclusion? That's the only thing needed for dividends.
Chill05/10/2019
a dev might want to contact Crypto Chico for some 'splaining
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs05/10/2019
I still haven't contacted the developer that was working on dividends. Was pretty busy with some other stuff. I will contact him this next week, and see where we are at for that.
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor05/10/2019
Chico doesn't do interviews, shame. Tron would be a much needed interview for his community
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs05/10/2019
As far as releasing dividends, I can be released at anytime the code is finished and doesn't require any voting or hardfork to occur
kryptoshi05/10/2019
Android asset aware wallet?
Seal <:cricat:> Clubber05/10/2019
Is in beta right
Tron05/10/2019
Testing went well today on Android. Nearing release.
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs05/10/2019
as it is a mechanism that is wallet specific
liqdmetal05/10/2019
no protocol level dividends you guys are saying?
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs05/10/2019
correct
Tron05/10/2019
DM me if you want to test Android with Asset support. I'll send you the .APK.
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor05/10/2019
RVN gonna be on tZero wallet? :yum:
liqdmetal05/10/2019
why not? what is the logic on non-protocol dividends
assets + protocol dividends is nirvana
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs05/10/2019
dividends is pretty much sending payments to addresses. Right now, you would have to do this manually. The dividends code, will allow this to be done quicker and easier.
No consensus changes are required.
Tron05/10/2019
New Android wallet is BIP44 and original Android wallet is BIP32/BIP39 so the words will not find the funds. You'll need to send them to another wallet, and then send them to new BIP44 derived address.
liqdmetal05/10/2019
we already have payments to addresses
so dividends is not a feature so much as simple wallet script
Hans_Schmidt05/10/2019
@[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs The dividend code changes look risky'er to me than messaging. Would you consider "tags" branch test-ready?
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs05/10/2019
Not yet @Hans_Schmidt
Dividends is easier then you would think if coded correctly. I still haven't seen the code from the community developer. Excited to view it though.
Hans_Schmidt05/10/2019
@[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs Sorry- I meant restricted, not dividend
kryptoshi05/10/2019
@Tron on the Android wallet, anyone successfully added their own node and got it to sync faster? Always have issues. I have a supped up node and cannot get it to work with the Android wallet...
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs05/10/2019
@Hans_Schmidt Oh, that makes more sense. Yes, they are very risky! That is why we are going to create a new bug bounty program for restricted assets testing.
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor05/10/2019
Once the network does get flooded w FPGAs, should we even consider changing the algo a couple times a year? That would only give bitstream developers added time to hoard their creations for themselves
Kind of like they're already doing with their x16r bitstreams :yum:
kryptoshi05/10/2019
Flooded... lol... like that hardware has mass production scale like gpus...come on dude
MrFanelli™05/10/2019
Bip44 wallet? :smiley:
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor05/10/2019
@kryptoshi Eventually yes, where there's $$$ to be made, people make things happen
MrFanelli™05/10/2019
So can we trade from that in the new Binance Dex when RVN get listed?
kryptoshi05/10/2019
@Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor Yes Soon TM lol. :soontm:
Tron05/10/2019
@kryptoshi There are some things we can do to speed it up. For a new wallet, it shouldn't need to sync. For recovered wallet, it needs to sync from beginning of BIP44 wallet support on iOS so words can be moved between the two.
Other options include grabbing the first derived address and looking it up on an explorer to see when it was first used and sync from there.
Another option is to add an optional number with the 12 words so it knows when to start syncing.
There isn't a good reason on an SPV wallet to sync before the seed was created.
kryptoshi05/10/2019
Cool. Glad you are looking at speedup options.. :right_facing_fist: :left_facing_fist:
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs05/10/2019
@MrFanelli™ If the binance dex support RVN deposits. I am sure you would be able to send from it
MrFanelli™05/10/2019
Has binance reached out for any info or anything?
I seen that we ranked in some voting competition they had on twitter
for an ama
Rikki RATTOE Sr. SEC Impresantor05/10/2019
I believe we'll need to create a fund of approximately $300,000 in order to get a BNB-RVN asset created and listed on the Binance FDEX
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs05/10/2019
In order to work with binance we need Ravencoin integrated into Blockbook.
Tron05/10/2019
@MrFanelli™ I've reached back out to Binance on the AMA.
MrFanelli™05/10/2019
Awesome :smile:
kryptoshi05/10/2019
@Tron you are a natural on the interviews... cool as a cucumber. :sunglasses:
Tron05/10/2019
Thanks @kryptoshi
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs05/10/2019
Cool. We are done for today.
Please don't ask us any more questions :smiley:
Tron05/10/2019
Thanks everyone!!!!
[Dev-Happy] Blondfrogs05/10/2019
Cya everyone!!
S1LVA | GetRavencoin.org05/10/2019
Cya happy feet, Thanks
Thanks Tron
Seal <:cricat:> Clubber05/10/2019
:bepbep:
submitted by mrderrik to Ravencoin [link] [comments]

Will FPGA's Replace GPU's? Introduction to FPGA Mining ... FPGA mining reborn , is FPGA mining really the next big thing??? Bitcoin Mining with FPGAs (EC551 Final Project) LEAKED 1.9Gh/s Ethereum Mining FPGA Card (Ubimust Lure ... Will FPGA For Mining Take Over?

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Will FPGA's Replace GPU's? Introduction to FPGA Mining ...

I want to give a shoutout to NotSoFast for tweeting about the FPGA's and also want to mention that my preorder is not like the preorder days of 2014 (i.e. Ti... This short video by Whitefire990 demonstrates an FPGA mining rig consisting of 8 Xilinx VCU1525 FPGA cards. The cards are running freely available software a... Will FPGA cards replace GPU cards for cryptocurrency mining? Let's review the best hardware for FPGA mining, mining profitability, and our new FPGA mining ri... I picked up a few PCI FPGA Cards on eBay for 99p which, apparently, can mine BitCoins at a speed of 21 Ghash/s (once they're correctly configured!) FPGA mining reborn , is FPGA mining really the next big thing ...

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